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I HAVE A QUESTION CAN A WRITER BE BIASEd

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ballersdreams

Sports Fanatic
Jan 7, 2014
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The CIF decide on Sunday the top 8 Norcal teams and put them in the open


CIF CLAY
3/8/15 3/10/15

1) SMS 1) SMS
2) MM 2) MM
3) SALESIAN 3) SALESIAN
4) SHC 4) SMB
5) SMB 5) DUBLIN
6) SI 6) SHC
7) PINEWOOD 7) PINEWOOD
8) MC 8) CARONDELET

How do does a person justify putting Dublin and Carondelet in the top 8 and the CIF Committee didn't ? The ranking in seeding order came out on 3/8 and gave a writer time to think if this is right or wrong. But if a writer is loyal to some team they will always put them up high. Just because a team beat another team doesn't make right to ranking the high so one teams stay ranked according to the writer. According to the CIF MC( 14 Norcalprep) and SI(11 Norcalprep) are the better teams then the writers teams. I understand there should be a difference but not that much of a difference. I guess their is biased to help some teams more the other and this telling the story in black and white.
 
Every ranking has to be what CIF thinks? You had Brookside as a top 10 all season and they barely cracked the Top 25 in Calhisports poll. Now look at them, where are they now? BC is right where they should be, a 4th seed in Division 4, a couple notches above the Highlanders.
 
Nor Cal Scout Posted


I think is a perfect example of what you are all about. I do not know ol bricklayer, his team or his daughter if he has one on the team. I have not heard him call out any team and make outlandish comments yet you want to slam on his team. However, all season from as far back as December you raved about how good brookside is and specifically cut down other teams and how they would beat them because of one reason or another. You even tried to throw my Highlanders under the bus because BC beat them.

Now we sit here and Brookside is out of the open and have a d4 runner up banner. In fairness, there was only one legitimate team in SJS d4 and BC was smoked! If you were there than you know the score did not reflect the actual butt kicking that took place. I was not there and that is second hand info but I think it is common knowledge at this point. Now the pressure in on Brookside to win D4. D2 only lost one team, Modesto Christian, which would have likely been a 4 seed in the d2 playoffs. D4 lost the #1 and #2 seed so it far more watered down than D2. You know that and I know that but yet you don't want to speak on that because you don't care about the truth.




Nor Cal Scout
Now d-4 is watered down !?!? Brookside is seeded 4 Piedmont is seeded 6 hopefully your Highlanders make it to the regional finals ??? since Brookside Smoked the Highlanders 73-57 in December !!! and you know the game was never close...........with that being said the road to the state championship game will be a cake walk if.
Brookside vs Piedmont ........... They might get their chance to redeem them self !?!? Now that's the truth.
 
Same post - I will cut and paste


Watered down? Yes. The top two seeds and the most dominate teams in d4 over the last decade have been removed from the open. Yes, it is watered down.

Piedmont has a tough road but in theory they caught a break as it is far better to be a #6 than a #4 or #5 if the bracket players out to true seeding.

57-73. It was close at 0-0 and that was about it. Brookside crushed us. BD already brought that a month ago and I conceded to that butt kicking. You see how easy that was. The refs did not cause us to lose nor was it because ClayK had any political ties. Brookside came, saw and conquered the Highlanders. End of story.

Now, do I think the addition of Dennis a clear D1 player will help us out in the potential rematch? YES! She will make a difference, as to how much? Who knows. We have West Campus on Wednesday and we need to focus on them first.

The truth and my opinion is in there and I did not have to rip on your school or any of your players to accomplish that.
 
Nor Cal Scout

Your know better than ballersdreams you just DEGRADED the entire D-4 inculding Piedmont !?!? Watered down can you explain that !!!!! HYPOCRITE that's what you are.............? just telling the truth or YOU CANT HANDLE THE TRUTH !?!?
Good luck HYPOCRITE
 
Originally posted by ballersdreams:

The CIF decide on Sunday the top 8 Norcal teams and put them in the open


CIF CLAY
3/8/15 3/10/15

1) SMS 1) SMS
2) MM 2) MM
3) SALESIAN 3) SALESIAN
4) SHC 4) SMB
5) SMB 5) DUBLIN
6) SI 6) SHC
7) PINEWOOD 7) PINEWOOD
8) MC 8) CARONDELET

How do does a person justify putting Dublin and Carondelet in the top 8 and the CIF Committee didn't ? The ranking in seeding order came out on 3/8 and gave a writer time to think if this is right or wrong. But if a writer is loyal to some team they will always put them up high. Just because a team beat another team doesn't make right to ranking the high so one teams stay ranked according to the writer. According to the CIF MC( 14 Norcalprep) and SI(11 Norcalprep) are the better teams then the writers teams. I understand there should be a difference but not that much of a difference. I guess their is biased to help some teams more the other and this telling the story in black and white.
Click to expand...
I didn't do any rankings, that I know of. That is, if you're referring to me ...

I wouldn't have put Dublin in the top eight, I don't think, though I haven't really sat down and gone through it. It's a pretty tough call overall for the Open, as there are a few teams that clearly belong, and then a large group to fill out the rest of the bracket.

On the larger question, of course writers are biased -- so is everyone. That's why opinions differ. Facts, however, are less in dispute.
 
I know what you are saying but I taught this one was a little over the top. Whoever did the ranking had time to think about this one just don't understand it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Hypocrite, Degrade????? The truth???

If you remove the Patriots and Seahawks from the NFL Playoffs would agree that the playoffs would have been watered down? Sure there would have been some good teams left. You replaced #1 & #2 seed with what #12 and #13. Yes, that is watered down. When the #1 seed finished as a semi-finalalst in their section it means it has been watered down.

No disrespect to those teams still in D4. Heck, those teams were home on Sunday hoping that SMB and Salesian were moved up so it would be watered down. Nice try #21
 
Scout -

I do not disagree with you but I am not going to complain. What was the true reason CIF adopted an Open Division?
 
why didn't norcal only send 6 teams? teams 7 and 8 have NO chance of winning a game...well a very small chance. I remember the first year of the open, Socal only have 4 or 6 teams in open.
 
We may never know that answer. I would assume to have the best play the best. Mater Dei Boys vs. Bishop O'Dowd Boys. Under the previous format they would never get to square off, now they do. Look at the girls open history BOD, D3 beat Windward a d4 school. Windward beat the #3 seed MD a D1 school while BOD Beat #2 seed SMS, also a D1 school. Last year in the South it was two D1 schools in #3 seed LBP and #4 seed Etiwanda. Here it was #4 Seed Salesian, D4 and #6 seed Miramonte, d3.

To that end the Open has had tremendous success is matching up the best teams, regardless of divisions. However, there are issues that need to be addressed and in time I am sure those will be addressed. If you took away the section limit the South could easily field a 16 team bracket while the North could be close to that number as well.

You have the first 8, now add in

9. Dublin
10. Vanden
11. Carondelet
12. Eastside Prep
13. Cardinal Newman
14. Mitty
15. Bradshaw Christian
16. Brookside Christian

SMS V BC
MM V Bradshaw
Salesian v. Mitty
SHC v. Cardinal Newman
SMB v. Eastside Prep
SI v. Carondelet
Pinewood v. Vanden
Modesto v. Dublin

To me that looks like a real state tournament. 3 game guarantee. Play out all of the places. Of course this would free Piedmont up to potentially win a state title.
 
Scout -

Piedmont had a great shot last year in DIV. They were seeded #3 in the NCS play-offs with Salesian and SMB almost guaranteed Open participants. Sometimes the higher seeds, even in "watered down divisions", do not get their work done.
 
I agree 100% because they are not true top seeds, if you will. #1 seed Cardinal Newman is very good and is actually improving a lot as the season progresses but they do not have the history, experience and swagger that a SMB or Salesian have. This makes them somewhat vulnerable to a perceived upset.

Northbay - Don't get too stressed, I am riding Cardinal Newman to Cal this season. They were in my top 16 for the open. Next year they will most definitely be an Open team, following the state runner up finish this season.
 
Last year, SoCal had six girls teams in open, and NorCal had six boys.

I think they got together and realized that they both needed to do the same thing, and either fill the Open or only have six.

Maybe it should just be four. That way all involved would have a reasonable chance, most years.
 
Clay,

That makes sense. Would you say that Socal has more "elite" teams than Norcal does? IT seems like it's easier to fill a more balanced/competitive bracket in Socal than in the North. Not taking anything away from any of the teams in the open division, but it's really a two horse race. In the South, Chaminade, Mater Dei, LBP, could easily win it (haven't seen Clovis play so can't comment on them). I'm probably gonna eat my words (I hope I do) but who is, in reality, going match up with Miramonte and SMS for 32 minutes?
 
SCOUT...


Haha...no worries :)

I know CN is vulnerable.

You make a great point about the lack of history, experience and swagger that CN lacks.

I truly feel that Salesian beat CN the other night because they have a crop girls that have the experience of back to back to back state championship games/runs. They are NOT going down easily. CN had them beat and couldn't finish it. Definite heart of a champion with Salesian.

The one thing CN has not done this season is win a close game against one of the big dogs.....they are continually getting
close, but no cigar.

D4 is wide friggin open....I think there are legitimately 5 teams that can win it.

...and your Piedmont squad is one of them


cant wait for Saturday!!
 
Originally posted by Norcal_Fan:
Clay,

That makes sense. Would you say that Socal has more "elite" teams than Norcal does? IT seems like it's easier to fill a more balanced/competitive bracket in Socal than in the North. Not taking anything away from any of the teams in the open division, but it's really a two horse race. In the South, Chaminade, Mater Dei, LBP, could easily win it (haven't seen Clovis play so can't comment on them). I'm probably gonna eat my words (I hope I do) but who is, in reality, going match up with Miramonte and SMS for 32 minutes?
Click to expand...
I don't think there's any doubt that year in and year out, SoCal has better teams. After all, they have a lot more schools, a lot more people and that translates into a lot more quality teams.

But even down south, I think you're right that only three teams really have a shot. Obviously, one could get upset, and maybe even two, but I would be very surprised if all three did.

Here, I don't think Miramonte is nearly as close to SMS as Chaminade, say, is to Poly or Mater Dei. If SMS loses, it will be a stunner, no doubt, and whichever other team went to the Open final would deservedly be a heavy underdog -- which is not to say that a NorCal team couldn't win, but rather that the odds would be stacked against it.
 
Pinewood can match up w Miramonte for 32 minutes. Interestingly, they have no other common opponents. Anyone besides me see that game, and disagree? I'm not trying to provoke an argument...
 
Outside of #8 at #1 it is likely that all the lower seeds can win the first round game of the open. Pinewood over Miramonte, SMB over Sacred Heart & SI over Salesian? Those would not be huge upsets, minor at best and if they swapped the seeds, Miramonte, SHC & Salesian could all beat them on the road as well.

Some folks may not like the Open Division but this is the basketball. I wish we could watch all four of these games at one venue on Saturday. The remaining divisions have some good teams, if not great teams in them but none will be tested until the finals, with the exception for AM and Carondelet in the Semi-Finals of D2.
 
Why isn't Presentation not rank and the team that the beat still ranked? I just don't understand that one because the week before Dublin won a jump up to #5? Can someone tell why is this?
 
14-14. Overall body of work. Same reason Brookside stayed ahead of Berkeley when Berkeley beat them. Brookside had too many other impressive wins and Berkeley had too many losses. Carondelet still has a win over Mitty. Presentation wins tonight and they will be forced to jump them up. Dublin also has a good record and with them only losing to Miramonte and Miramonte winning helps.

This is just a guess but it does warrant conversation.
 
Why is SI at #8 ? You would think they would be high since the are in the final 4 in the open ? Then you would think the team that lost in the open would be ranked in the top 8. Salesian deserves to be in the top 8 as well as does MC losing to SMS. You would think all the teams in the open would be in the top 8 since the CIF put them in the Open. I would think what a team done all year shouldn't matter it's about how they finish the year off. But whom am I to give this type of opinion?
This post was edited on 3/17 9:46 AM by RespectBBGame
 
Welcome back, ballersdreams.

What political reasons? Is this more inside stuff? Things only a select few know about, one of whom just happens to be you?

And it would seem that the "rights of free speech amendment" would mean that you could say "which ranking".

But not making sense is better than making things up ...
 
I think it make perfect sense because I have been advised by VIP Family membership yahoo not to speak on this issue right now and yes I'm a member. Freedom of Speech is a Federal law that can be under written by any person or company on a forums. In my opinion.
 
It doesn't make sense because you don't know how to write. And yes, we know you do it on purpose to get a rise out of people...I think you're funny.
 
O'...layer

I guess some people ranking doesn't matter obviously in my opinion !!! The Open didn't consist 2 teams in the top 8 but #11 and #14 made it. But we all know why this happen and why rankings are done in a certain way. I don't see why all the team that was in the open are not in the top eight in ranking they deserved that because what the committee put them there. But that's my opinion.
 
Originally posted by RespectBBGame:

O'...layer

I guess some people ranking doesn't matter obviously in my opinion !!! The Open didn't consist 2 teams in the top 8 but #11 and #14 made it. But we all know why this happen and why rankings are done in a certain way. I don't see why all the team that was in the open are not in the top eight in ranking they deserved that because what the committee put them there. But that's my opinion.
Click to expand...
So enlighten me, because I don't know -- why are rankings done in a certain way? What are these political issues you speak of?

And please, don't just say "money and power." Specifics would be much better, and letting us know just how these back-room deals (which I think you are referring to) go down. Does someone hand a section commissioner a paper bag full of money in a dark alley somewhere? Does some school threaten a commissioner that they have the votes to fire him over the seeding of girls' basketball (which by the way loses money for sections and CIF)?

And point out, since you claim to be able to tell it like it is, exactly which commissioners are voting the "wrong" way? Is it the SJS commissioner? Oakland? Northern Section?

And yes, you have freedom of speech -- that's what the Second Amendment is all about. As long as you're telling us the truth, and you assure us you know what the truth is, you're fine. (Libel and slander laws begin with truth as the best defense.)

This vague conspiracy you constantly refer to is empty rhetoric, and repeating it doesn't make it any more believable. It's like claiming officials are somehow told which teams should win games because it matters to CIF which girls' teams move on in the playoffs. Why would anyone care? Why would anyone risk their livelihood for an event that loses money, and even the best matchup only marginally increases the revenue?

Please enlighten us because, after all, you know how everything works.
 
Clay

I have source for all that I talk about but I will never reveal them. Knowledge is a powerfully thing and knowing the inner workings is another. This reminds me of a Vietnam war with all the propaganda that goes on. People promoting teams over others outside the inner circle and players higher then others players to that play for different teams. For example, ranking players from one AAU team then others and this cover by putting 1 or 2 others in the ranking. This knowing college scouts look at some sites and yes I have been told this from a college scout but wont reveal them. But the scout ask why is this players rank high then others players. But all this is my Opinion to this politico correct Freedom of Speech and answer I don't assume anything I just have a lot inside source that I will never reveal. Assume nothing just speaking for the people that cant speak up. But all this is my opinion
 
College basketball does not have scouts. They have assistant coaches and along with the head coaches do the scouting, evaluation, recruiting etc of the student athletes. You are not speaking up for the people that can't speak up. You are speaking up because you feel personally disrespected as coach, trainer and mentor. Have you ever thought, or TAUGHT that maybe you are not doing your job correctly? If your players are the ones that are not getting the recognition they deserve then perhaps your methodology and how you serve those in your association needs some revamping. Hating and downgrading others on a public forum that is NOT READ by college SCOUTS is not a good use of your time, if helping kids and speaking up for others is what you are all about.

You indicate you have a source for that you talk about: "I have source for all that I talk about but I will never reveal them." So basically you have nothing to add personally so are admitting you don't know @#$%, as you need a source. Respect, count your days as they are numbered on this board because what i have learned is that idiots never do learn and at some point you will cross that line and NCP will remove you yet again, right SMALLFRY!
 
Nor Cal Scout

You are part of the problem part of the inner circle. So of coarse your action show that making me like I'm confused to keep the Propaganda going on and on. But we will see in the end what is real going on. Cant go into details right now because I'm advised not to talk about certain thing by VIP Family Membership of Yahoo. The right of freedom of speech and the write not to reveal my source within.

Yes my days are number in the right way because of actions that cant talk about $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
In my opinion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This post was edited on 3/19 9:27 AM by RespectBBGame
 
Nor Cal Scout,

I was pleased to learn that you are a member in good standing of the Inner Circle. I have always wanted to be a member of your organization, and was hoping you could help me to achieve this goal. Please let me know of any qualifications that are required, and how I might apply.

Thanks,

SouthBayHoopFan
 
There's so much money in girls' high school basketball that there are inner circles that ballersdreams knows about but can't reveal.

Funny, I've been a voter for McDonald's since the very first ballot -- and I have never once been contacted by anyone asking me to do something with my vote.

Not once. Zero. Nada.

Now, maybe the McDonald's voters aren't the inner circle, but maybe those who pick regional and national all-star teams are. Well, I do those too, and I vote for the Naismith and Wooden college awards, and also for all-WNBA.

I have never, ever, ever been contacted by anyone in any regard about changing my rankings or my ballot.

Not once. Zero. Nada.

I've picked all-American teams for Parade, Sports Illustrated, Slam, MaxPreps and many others. I have never, ever, ever been contacted by anyone in any regard about changing my rankings or my ballot.

Not once. Zero. Nada.

And why would anyone? As you point out, the college coaches don't pay any attention to the rankings, and though some rankings are influenced by outside forces, a player is a player no matter what some old white guy like me has to say.

There's just not enough at stake to try to manipulate the system, which is why the inner circle ballersdreams refers to is a figment of conspiracy theorists' imaginations.

These, ballersdreams, are facts, from a source. You can believe what you want, but without sources, they're just beliefs with no more basis in reality for outsiders than elves or dragons.
 
Inner circle? Propoganda? Freedom of Speech? I posted a poll to get you kicked out and then you physically threatened someone and NCP did what they had to do.

Smallfry/Ballersdream/RespectBBGame - It did not take long for you to reveal your identity and hatred you toward others. You talk about inner circle, when in reality if a player, coach or team is not in your inner circle you scream politics, foul and backroom handshake deals.

My advice for you is to respect the game and to do that you must show respect on this board.
 
Nor Cal Scout

I really appreciate you not including me in your Post :::::::: !?!? Luvthegame21 Now who wins Saturday's game Brookside vs Piedmont ???
 
You don't bash kids and blame their success on politics.....

No disrespect to your coach but Gardere is in a class of his own. Brookside has the best player but Piedmont has faced her and they have faced others in their league equal to or better than her. Robertson, Welch-Coleman and Thomas.. So they should be ready.

Piedmont has been through a lot over the last two years and while it would be a mild upset I am sticking with the Highlanders 59-55.
 
I don't think a win by Piedmont would be a upset your Highlanders earned the right to be in this position to play for a State title !?!? But the bus stops on Saturday .......... Brookside wins by 10+
 
A four seed against a six seed is a favorite. BC was a lock for the an open until Bradshaw upended them. Initially I thought perhaps Bradshaw exposed them but now I am convinced it was more of a match up issue and that BC is probably the better team. It should be a great game. Coach Gardere is one of the best and preparing his team so it will definitely be worth the drive.
 
Nor Cal Scout

Every loss this year Brookside has it was never because of a match up problem !!! Brookside for whatever reason just wasn't ready too play Bradshaw ??? maybe they thought they could role the balls out and win !?!? lesson learned expect the best tomorrow from Brookside keep the bus running !?!? Goodluck
 
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