CTE danger?

[ClayK]

I'm a girls' basketball coach, and post on that board, but I've covered Cal football for the past 15 years for AP and Bear Insider, so the column linked to is grounded in more than casual observations. I covered high school football directly for many years, but that was some time ago.

In any event, this appeared in StudentSports: https://sportstarsmag.com/head-case-fear-football/

 

[colhenrylives]

This mom might also be advised to take a look at lacrosse, ice hockey and soccer, among other sports, to weigh head injury statistics. Let's not even mention boxing or MMA.

 

[ILOVETROJANFOOTBALL]

This mom might also be advised to take a look at lacrosse, ice hockey and soccer, among other sports, to weigh head injury statistics. Let's not even mention boxing or MMA.

Or rugby....

 

[paul_johnson884]

"OK, this is not a completely scientific survey, due to the sample size and how the samples were selected",

you should have ended the article right at this sentence.

The cultural war on football continues ....

 

[ILOVETROJANFOOTBALL]

"OK, this is not a completely scientific survey, due to the sample size and how the samples were selected",

you should have ended the article right at this sentence.

The cultural war on football continues ....

My daughter played girls basketball. Her team won the section title. In her junior year she was concussed when her head hit the floor. Then senior year, tore the MCL. You can get hurt playing sports.....any sport.

 

[bulldogmgc]

Agree ... in any sport, there is the risk. Heck! I have more injuries from playing basketball than I do from martial arts. I even got stitches above my eye due to an incident playing tennis and lost a tooth playing racquetball. My eldest son's high school senior year in football and wrestling was abandoned due to an injury (basilar skull fracture) he sustained in wrestling (not football) during his junior year. I even, most recently, pulled my hamstring playing table tennis when my foot slid out from under me and my leg over-stretched. Despite the risks, we aren't living properly if we are not physically active. Actively participating in sports, any sport, beats sitting idle and getting fat playing video games. IMHO, there is just too many alarmists in this world. Not against understanding and preparing for the risks. But, strongly opposed to killing a sport because of risks. Of course, there are limits. Any we all must understand what they are to best know how to deal with them. But, shutting down something for everyone because of "incidents" for "some" just ain't right. Just my opinion, nothing more.

 

[colhenrylives]

It's one thing to tear a hamstring or sprain a throwing shoulder; it's quite another to suffer a head injury (or multiple blows to the head) resulting in some form of brain damage. Lots of luck repairing that. And there's the football dilemma. It's a sport that places its athletes at inherent risk of head injuries.

 

[Lil49erCoach]

This is not an issue that can be handled by 30-second sound bites, everyone has to get into this and understand it for themselves.

 

[northbayfb]

So Clay, no mention of concussion protocol? Surely as a former AD you know about the steps to improve athlete health. Why not mention the improvements? It is now commonplace for football players to miss games as a safeguard for student athlete health related to head injury. Number one fatality sport is cycling, you know where the end result is being dead. Are there cries to not ride a bike? No, we are educating both the riding and non-riding public. We are improving product safety. We are creating laws to make cycling less dangerous. Steps that should sound similar to you if you follow football. Will these laws stop fatalities in cycling? No. Will they lower the occurrence? Only time will tell but its a step in the right direction. You could have educated both mom and child about the steps that have improved athlete safety over the last 3 to 5 years. I'm sorry you chose not to use that platform for educating both sides of the equation, but instead chose to fan the flames. I do have one final question, since when does half of 15% equal 10%?

 

[ClayK]

Of course it's safer now, and of course it's not black and white.

But for me, the key is that a brain injury is different than a knee injury, and that you don't really know how much your brain is being affected -- and everyone is affected in different ways. Some can take repeated blows to the head with no damage; others cannot, but there's no way to tell the difference as it's occurring. I can tell if my knee hurts, or is hurt, and make decisions based on that. But I don't know what's happening in my head.

Football is, in many ways, a great sport. It's a great teamwork sport, and it requires most successful players to work hard to reach their potential. To me, this line of discussion is not part of a cultural war on football (whatever that might mean) but rather a series of questions that all participants and their families must ask. Is the risk worth the reward?

In girls' basketball, for example, I would say that girls and their families should carefully consider the strength and structure of the girl's knee before getting serious, as the risk of an ACL tear to some girls is very high. Again, risk vs. reward.

But even an ACL can be repaired so normal function in life is possible; not so with a brain injury.

 

[northbayfb]

Of course it's safer now, and of course it's not black and white.

But for me, the key is that a brain injury is different than a knee injury, and that you don't really know how much your brain is being affected -- and everyone is affected in different ways. Some can take repeated blows to the head with no damage; others cannot, but there's no way to tell the difference as it's occurring. I can tell if my knee hurts, or is hurt, and make decisions based on that. But I don't know what's happening in my head.

Football is, in many ways, a great sport. It's a great teamwork sport, and it requires most successful players to work hard to reach their potential. To me, this line of discussion is not part of a cultural war on football (whatever that might mean) but rather a series of questions that all participants and their families must ask. Is the risk worth the reward?

In girls' basketball, for example, I would say that girls and their families should carefully consider the strength and structure of the girl's knee before getting serious, as the risk of an ACL tear to some girls is very high. Again, risk vs. reward.

But even an ACL can be repaired so normal function in life is possible; not so with a brain injury.

The point is the reader came to you for guidance. He and his Mom are both aware of CTE as she read the article and he referenced it. What you did not tell them is that there have been rule changes that have reduced helmet to helmet contact. These rules will statistically impact a similar survey like the one you referenced in the years to come. Even your 30+ old football player experienced a completely different game than the one being played today. Concussions are also a part of basketball, and any sport that there is a risk of concussion has a potential for brain damage. My point is simply that problem solving by being better educated and creating better guidelines is the answer. Not fear mongering.

 

[bulldogmgc]

Which high school athlete has the most risk for concussion, per WebMD? Hmm?

Maybe a similar article on its way for this sport, as well? Maybe they should start wearing helmets or similar gear in this sport? Is the risk vs the reward worth participating in this sport?

 

[bulldogmgc]

Yet, a different article reflecting some different statistics ... Why High School Girls Have More Risk For Concussion Than Boys. Does this mean we should take away playing sports for high school girls? Is the risk vs the reward worthy of allowing girls to participate in high school sports?

“These certainly are the kinds of issues that they can discuss with their athletic trainers, with sports medicine doctors, with their teams and coaches,” Dr. Russman says. “The goal is to understand the type of conditioning an athlete needs to undergo to help to reduce his or her risk of all sorts of injuries, including concussion.”

 

[bulldogmgc]

Fake news?

 

[ClayK]

There certainly is a greater risk for girls when it comes to concussions. Again, risk vs. reward, make a conscious decision.

For example, one family I know decided their girls shouldn't play soccer and head the ball, given the above info. I'm not saying that's the right choice, or that girls should quit playing soccer, but it's a choice one family made after considering the facts available to them.

If a family has a history of knee injuries, basketball might not be the best. Weak shoulders? Baseball and volleyball might not work out as well as other sports. Or more attention could be paid to preventing those kinds of injuries.

It's not black and white, and it's not simple. As always, though, choices must be made ...

 

[joebl]

"OK, this is not a completely scientific survey, due to the sample size and how the samples were selected",

you should have ended the article right at this sentence.

The cultural war on football continues ....

That article may not have been the most well researched or best written, but there is plenty of evidence that NFL players are clearly effected by CTE. I think based on small sample size and not a true random sampling has not allowed the scientific community to 100% prove out the risk at HS level. But would you want to take a chance with your own kid? To me, it was not worth the chance. I played both Football and Rugby, and had concussions in both. I have no idea if/how it will effect me as I age. When my son asked if he could play football, the answer was yes to Flag/Touch, but NO! to tackle. I am not willing to take the risk because enough studies have not been done. When my son becomes an adult, he can make his own decision, but until he does I wont take the chance. Football is my favorite sport - both to watch and play (when I was younger). The trend is showing fewer kids are playing tackle football. I do see this eventually effecting the NFL popularity, so hoping that they find some more ways to limit the injuries. So far 99% of former NFL players they have been able to look at had CTE. Even with smaller sample size, you cannot discount that statistically!

More recent info: https://www.forbes.com/sites/taraha...hool-and-college-players-brains/#2a6660e212c6

 

[Lil49erCoach]

I played rugby for a season in college. 2nd game I did a tackle bad, head slid down the back of the leg right into his cleat. 6 stitches on the left eye orbit. Nearly lost an eye.

2 seasons ago we had a football player play basketball. Dove and took a header. Broke a front tooth, jammed the other into his gum. Concussion. Had a shoulder injury in football, but no concussions.

2 seasons ago we had a JV player get 2 concussions on the same play. Neither hit was substantial. Pass blocking and slid down hit the defenders knee. QB throws a pick so he gets up and heads downfield, DB cuts in front of him, he tries to make the tackle, another concussion within 8 seconds or so. He's got some physical issues that he's still working through.

Had a player 5 years ago that fell off his skateboard going down a hill and got a bad concussion. Almost fractured his skull. He's had 3 concussions, none from football.

Track kid drops a shot on his foot in the ring, broke 3 toes, almost had to lose 1.

Female soccer player here got a concussion and had physical coordination issues for several months after.

I know a classmate from college that was playing rugby. Got in a scrum, got his neck bent, then broken. In a chair for 3 years, uses canes today.

I hit a safety my senior year that was head to head, crown to crown. His helmet was 1" lower than mine so he bent my facemask almost to my nose and that was when it was the steel linemen cage with a full nose bar.

My first helmet was a suspension helmet that I broke and resewed it back together.

3 kids have been killed here in the past 4 years from car accidents.

Football is a collision sport that favors big, fast, strong, athletes. I have no issue with parents/players making an informed decision not to play football. Or with them playing something else. But what I do not approve of is making a decision like this based on invalid/incomplete/premature studies or a sound bite or a headline or a conversation with a friend that has a girlfriend that has a cousin that played for a year. We all have a responsibility to help parents make an informed decision. And that means we have to be informed. But right now it seems that football (and eventually soccer, then basketball, then baseball, then.....) is being branded as the Bad Neighbor without much thought as to what can be gained from football.

Is football violent and subject to inflict injuries? Yes. Does it have value in the development of a young man? Yes. All I ask is for parents to be provided with a full set of data and let them make the decision without every headline seeming to be screaming at them that they are stupid for letting their child even consider football.

 

[feedback1]

This is the problem. Well meaning people who grew up in the Purell culture, armed with poor information are making decision to limit the risk to their kids. There is nothing that raises more emotion than 'I have to protect my kid' and that leads to decisions that avoid all risk.

First, that study of the NFL players is completely biased. It is not a random, double-blind study that is based in scientific data. The sample was chosen from players who had exhibited the symptoms of CTE (depression, loss of focus, dementia, etc). Of course they found near 100% were affected, it was inevitable based on the way the study was setup. They did not even study NFL players who did not exhibit symptoms of CTE, let alone the public at large.

As was mentioned, any player who plays football today will experience a completely different game than adults experienced when they grew up. Coach's education, equipment, concussion protocol and practice methods are all very different than what those NFL players experienced. Many of those players grew up in an age where ignoring concussions and continuing to play while you threw up between plays was a sign of toughness.

Second, we have not seen any evidence that CTE is caused by the type of contact that we see in high school. But it is easy to extrapolate and it is faulty logic. Concussions cause CTE. High school football players get concussions. Therefore, high school football players suffer from CTE.

I think it is a very understandable that a parent trying to protect their kid will draw on this logic and reason that they are doing right by their kid to not allow them to play football.

Third, there was no concussion protocol available to these players that were studied. So there is no way to know how many concussions those players suffered, if they came off the field after receiving a concussion, and if they experienced repeated concussions (and over what time frame). We know that a concussions have an additive effect - that a concussion suffered on top of an existing concussion is much worse than a single concussion.

A parent has two ways to make the decision. An emotional based decision will be to remove all risk from their kid. Logic and science rarely overcome the emotion. But those parents may not know that the statistics show that their kid is much more likely to die is from Accidents (auto, pools, etc), Suicide and Homicide, Cancer and Heart Disease. If these well meaning parents really wanted to protect their kid, they would not let them get a driver's license as that accounts for one-third of all teen deaths.

A logic based decision is to examine statistical evidence (and examine how the data is gathered, who is gathering it, and who is paying for it). Then make an informed decision. Hopefully in consultation with the kid.

 

[joebl]

I played rugby for a season in college. 2nd game I did a tackle bad, head slid down the back of the leg right into his cleat. 6 stitches on the left eye orbit. Nearly lost an eye.

2 seasons ago we had a football player play basketball. Dove and took a header. Broke a front tooth, jammed the other into his gum. Concussion. Had a shoulder injury in football, but no concussions.

2 seasons ago we had a JV player get 2 concussions on the same play. Neither hit was substantial. Pass blocking and slid down hit the defenders knee. QB throws a pick so he gets up and heads downfield, DB cuts in front of him, he tries to make the tackle, another concussion within 8 seconds or so. He's got some physical issues that he's still working through.

Had a player 5 years ago that fell off his skateboard going down a hill and got a bad concussion. Almost fractured his skull. He's had 3 concussions, none from football.

Track kid drops a shot on his foot in the ring, broke 3 toes, almost had to lose 1.

Female soccer player here got a concussion and had physical coordination issues for several months after.

I know a classmate from college that was playing rugby. Got in a scrum, got his neck bent, then broken. In a chair for 3 years, uses canes today.

I hit a safety my senior year that was head to head, crown to crown. His helmet was 1" lower than mine so he bent my facemask almost to my nose and that was when it was the steel linemen cage with a full nose bar.

My first helmet was a suspension helmet that I broke and resewed it back together.

3 kids have been killed here in the past 4 years from car accidents.

Football is a collision sport that favors big, fast, strong, athletes. I have no issue with parents/players making an informed decision not to play football. Or with them playing something else. But what I do not approve of is making a decision like this based on invalid/incomplete/premature studies or a sound bite or a headline or a conversation with a friend that has a girlfriend that has a cousin that played for a year. We all have a responsibility to help parents make an informed decision. And that means we have to be informed. But right now it seems that football (and eventually soccer, then basketball, then baseball, then.....) is being branded as the Bad Neighbor without much thought as to what can be gained from football.

Is football violent and subject to inflict injuries? Yes. Does it have value in the development of a young man? Yes. All I ask is for parents to be provided with a full set of data and let them make the decision without every headline seeming to be screaming at them that they are stupid for letting their child even consider football.

I think your statement, "But what I do not approve of is making a decision like this based on invalid/incomplete/premature studies" is the reason why kids should NOT play football. Until it is proved to be reasonably safe by studies, do you want to risk your kids health when they are not capable of making their own informed decision? There is irrefutable evidence at the NFL level (111 out of 112 to me proves the causation), what is unknown is playing at younger years. I'm not willing to take that chance with my kids and dont think any parent should either without being fully informed based on the current information. I dont believe football has inherent benefits that cannot be gained by multiple other sports.

 

[paul_johnson884]

Of course it's safer now, and of course it's not black and white.

But for me, the key is that a brain injury is different than a knee injury, and that you don't really know how much your brain is being affected -- and everyone is affected in different ways. Some can take repeated blows to the head with no damage; others cannot, but there's no way to tell the difference as it's occurring. I can tell if my knee hurts, or is hurt, and make decisions based on that. But I don't know what's happening in my head.

Football is, in many ways, a great sport. It's a great teamwork sport, and it requires most successful players to work hard to reach their potential. To me, this line of discussion is not part of a cultural war on football (whatever that might mean) but rather a series of questions that all participants and their families must ask. Is the risk worth the reward?

In girls' basketball, for example, I would say that girls and their families should carefully consider the strength and structure of the girl's knee before getting serious, as the risk of an ACL tear to some girls is very high. Again, risk vs. reward.

But even an ACL can be repaired so normal function in life is possible; not so with a brain injury.

You were not aware of the cultural war on football in America? Not surprising based on the amount of research you put into this article.

There is a growing segment of Americans who are hell bent on outlawing football in the US. They are becoming more effective as evidenced by your un informed article. Hopefully, the excellent posts above have opened your eyes to the complexity of this issue. They should also make you pause before you write another article full of anecdotal evidence and emotion rather than science and reason.

 

[paul_johnson884]

That article may not have been the most well researched or best written, but there is plenty of evidence that NFL players are clearly effected by CTE. I think based on small sample size and not a true random sampling has not allowed the scientific community to 100% prove out the risk at HS level. But would you want to take a chance with your own kid? To me, it was not worth the chance. I played both Football and Rugby, and had concussions in both. I have no idea if/how it will effect me as I age. When my son asked if he could play football, the answer was yes to Flag/Touch, but NO! to tackle. I am not willing to take the risk because enough studies have not been done. When my son becomes an adult, he can make his own decision, but until he does I wont take the chance. Football is my favorite sport - both to watch and play (when I was younger). The trend is showing fewer kids are playing tackle football. I do see this eventually effecting the NFL popularity, so hoping that they find some more ways to limit the injuries. So far 99% of former NFL players they have been able to look at had CTE. Even with smaller sample size, you cannot discount that statistically!

More recent info: https://www.forbes.com/sites/taraha...hool-and-college-players-brains/#2a6660e212c6

Yes I would let my kid take that risk if he wanted ... and I did allow my kid to take that risk.
I also let me kids ride their bikes, skateboards, play basketball, soccer, baseball, ride in cars, etc.

I believe you have the right to stop your kid from playing football. Just dont shove your values down other parents throats, quickly becoming a favorite of Americans today.

It all comes back to freedom. Keep the government and the nosy neighbors out of my parenting and I will do the same for you.

 

[northbayfb]

I think your statement, "But what I do not approve of is making a decision like this based on invalid/incomplete/premature studies" is the reason why kids should NOT play football. Until it is proved to be reasonably safe by studies, do you want to risk your kids health when they are not capable of making their own informed decision? There is irrefutable evidence at the NFL level (111 out of 112 to me proves the causation), what is unknown is playing at younger years. I'm not willing to take that chance with my kids and dont think any parent should either without being fully informed based on the current information. I dont believe football has inherent benefits that cannot be gained by multiple other sports.

5.7% of high school football players go on to play college football of that pool 1.8% go on to play the NFL or 0.1% of high school players go on to the NFL of that some percentage suffers from CTE. Let's be aggressive and say it's 50% or 0.005% of high school football players. 6.14% of 16 year olds will be involved in all fatal crashes, 4.6% for 17 yr olds. Since you feel comfortable saying that all parents should not let their kids play football until all information is available. I have no problem telling you that letting your kid drive would be grossly inconsistent with your parenting concerns.

 

[joebl]

Yes I would let my kid take that risk if he wanted ... and I did allow my kid to take that risk.
I also let me kids ride their bikes, skateboards, play basketball, soccer, baseball, ride in cars, etc.

I believe you have the right to stop your kid from playing football. Just dont shove your values down other parents throats, quickly becoming a favorite of Americans today.

It all comes back to freedom. Keep the government and the nosy neighbors out of my parenting and I will do the same for you.

I don't see anyone shoving values down anyone else's throats... But, IF there is a significant and proven link between youth tackle football and CTE, that we will likely see some laws passed to limit youth participation. Since that doesn't exist today (and maybe it doesn't exist at all, so just a hypothetical scenario), there is no reason to worry about any government involvement.

 

[paul_johnson884]

I don't see anyone shoving values down anyone else's throats... But, IF there is a significant and proven link between youth tackle football and CTE, that we will likely see some laws passed to limit youth participation. Since that doesn't exist today (and maybe it doesn't exist at all, so just a hypothetical scenario), there is no reason to worry about any government involvement.

Then you havent been paying attention. There are plenty of people happy to shove their values down others throats- not just in regards to football.

No reason to worry about the government? They have held hearings in the US Congress already ... if that doesnt make you pause, nothing will.

 

[joebl]

5.7% of high school football players go on to play college football of that pool 1.8% go on to play the NFL or 0.1% of high school players go on to the NFL of that some percentage suffers from CTE. Let's be aggressive and say it's 50% or 0.005% of high school football players. 6.14% of 16 year olds will be involved in all fatal crashes, 4.6% for 17 yr olds. Since you feel comfortable saying that all parents should not let their kids play football until all information is available. I have no problem telling you that letting your kid drive would be grossly inconsistent with your parenting concerns.

No offense, but what you wrote make no sense.
1) I did not say parents should not play football until all information is available, i wrote all parents should not allow kids to play until fully informed based on the current information. There is a big difference.
2) Your HS to College to NFL stats are irrelevant to your argument. The current study showed that 0% (out of 2) youth only footballers (did not play beyond youth) had CTE, 21% of HS Football players (out of 14) that did not play further than HS, 91% of College (out of 53), and 99+% of NFL (110 out of 111) had CTE. Sample size is too small to draw definitive conclusion, but further study is warranted and so is parental concern. We dont know what other factors/conditions play a part and with such small sample size, hard to discount the fact that all of those percentages from HS and above are too high to ignore.
3)I do not believe your driving statistics as stated to be true. Please cite your evidence. While it is true that 16 yr olds have a higher rate of fatal accidents than other ages, it is not over 6% of 16yr olds are involved in one. Citing source will clarify. Regardless, education, good parenting, and lots of practice reduces risk tremendously. Driving is a necessity where I live, so its not like this is for fun, it is something that has to be done.

 

[joebl]

Then you havent been paying attention. There are plenty of people happy to shove their values down others throats- not just in regards to football.

No reason to worry about the government? They have held hearings in the US Congress already ... if that doesnt make you pause, nothing will.

IF Football causes CTE, then Government has an obligation to investigate and potentially limit the play for youths. As an adult, you can make your own decision whether to put yourself at risk. As more information comes in, it seems to continue to imply Football causes CTE. A lot more studies are needed, and hopefully NFL and the Gov't can invest in getting the proper research done on CTE and take steps to reduce, diagnose, cure, etc...
So NO, I'm not worried at this point because the evidence is not there yet. I have no worry about Gov't hearings because it is path for funding to find out the truth.

 

[northbayfb]

No offense, but what you wrote make no sense.
1) I did not say parents should not play football until all information is available, i wrote all parents should not allow kids to play until fully informed based on the current information. There is a big difference.
2) Your HS to College to NFL stats are irrelevant to your argument. The current study showed that 0% (out of 2) youth only footballers (did not play beyond youth) had CTE, 21% of HS Football players (out of 14) that did not play further than HS, 91% of College (out of 53), and 99+% of NFL (110 out of 111) had CTE. Sample size is too small to draw definitive conclusion, but further study is warranted and so is parental concern. We dont know what other factors/conditions play a part and with such small sample size, hard to discount the fact that all of those percentages from HS and above are too high to ignore.
3)I do not believe your driving statistics as stated to be true. Please cite your evidence. While it is true that 16 yr olds have a higher rate of fatal accidents than other ages, it is not over 6% of 16yr olds are involved in one. Citing source will clarify. Regardless, education, good parenting, and lots of practice reduces risk tremendously. Driving is a necessity where I live, so its not like this is for fun, it is something that has to be done.

1.)Source DMV and statistically more sound.
2.) interesting that you believe that education, good parenting and lots of practice can reduce risk in the same uncontrollable circumstances one finds on the football field
3.) Ah yes the argument of convenience. It's your kid and it's up to you to believe you can control factors out of our control. Like weather, other drivers, etc

Suggesting your kid not drive was supposed to open your eyes to the absurdity of it all. Oh well, I whiffed on that one.

 

[paul_johnson884]

IF Football causes CTE, then Government has an obligation to investigate and potentially limit the play for youths. As an adult, you can make your own decision whether to put yourself at risk. As more information comes in, it seems to continue to imply Football causes CTE. A lot more studies are needed, and hopefully NFL and the Gov't can invest in getting the proper research done on CTE and take steps to reduce, diagnose, cure, etc...
So NO, I'm not worried at this point because the evidence is not there yet. I have no worry about Gov't hearings because it is path for funding to find out the truth.

Well that explains alot regarding your POV- i am not surprised.

The government has no obligation to study CTE or any other football risk. Especially not the federal government. Private industry will take on this issue without government help and in fact will do a better job of it for the simple reason they have MUCH more to lose then the government.

Private industry had already started studying this serious issue long before the goofballs in DC heard of CTE. Government involvement will bring inefficiency, grossly more costs, grossly more regulations and will negatively impact football forever. Keep those clowns out of it- I trust the doctors, parents, coaches and football experts MUCH more than the government.

You must not watch government hearings, they are largely BS side shows for Congress members to get on TV or in the media.

 

[ClayK]

I have to question how much private industry would do on their own.

Whatever helmet companies are left have no incentive to protect anyone from CTE until they are sued. As has been pointed out, there have been significant improvements in safety in recent years, but all of those improvements could have been made decades ago if the companies had wanted to. Like the cigarette industry, the helmet industry had no reason to research or publish any health data, as it only would have cost them money.

For private industries, safety takes second to profits. I do not trust in the generosity of spirit of CEOs who are happy to make 30 to 50 times what most of their employees make.

 

[concrete17]

Agree ... in any sport, there is the risk. Heck! I have more injuries from playing basketball than I do from martial arts. I even got stitches above my eye due to an incident playing tennis and lost a tooth playing racquetball. .....I even, most recently, pulled my hamstring playing table tennis when my foot slid out from under me and my leg over-stretched. Despite the risks, we aren't living properly if we are not physically active. Actively participating in sports, any sport, beats sitting idle and getting fat playing video games. Just my opinion, nothing more.....

Not intending to make light of a serious subject...But bulldogMac you remind me of the Black Knight..... I would give serious thought about meeting you in competition ....Crete

 

[paul_johnson884]

oh brother ... the evil corporations!
Funny how fewer and fewer Americans understand capitalism. Even fewer understand how capitalism has elevated more people to levels never seen before ... but they are soooo greedy! LOL

Lets go back to free market 101 : This football issue is no different than eating at a restaurant. The customers tell you what they want. If you serve lousy food and it makes you sick, either the restaurant changes or goes out of business.
Now put parents, football coaches, AD's, the NFL, NCAA, TV, etc in the place of the customer in the restaurant example and you have reality.

Many, many of those evil CEO's you flippantly disparage give millions to charities around the globe. They drive our incredible economies, improve our lives, including our health, provide jobs, increase incomes ... and on and on. I trust them a billion times more than some unaccountable politician or bureaucrat. It isnt even close.

It is opinions like yours why we have the government telling us what cars we can buy, what toilets we can buy, what light bulbs we can buy, what schools we can attend. Wake up before it is too late.

**I wont quote you since it seems to upset you.**

 

[bulldogmgc]

Not intending to make light of a serious subject...But bulldogMac you remind me of the Black Knight..... I would give serious thought about meeting you in competition ....Crete

View embedded media

Love Monty Python! Love the Black Knight scene you shared! A bit of a stretch, but the Black Knight could be more resembling of our NorCal teams playing the SoCal teams in these early pre-league match-ups this season. Still, kudos for putting the effort forward.

Who knows maybe if we give up playing sports that have "any" risk we might indeed be destined to be like the humans in this movie??? ...

 

[Ca. Football rules]

All HS athletes should be given baseline testing before first practice in desired sport. This is a proven useful tool for not only diagnosing a concussion but also can be used to see when brain has recovered and then decision can be made about a return to playing.

 

[ClayK]

Some trust most CEOs and industry to do the right thing; some feel most CEOs are more concerned with profit than the public good.

That's a cultural divide, no question ...

But the "cultural attack" on football most likely has more to do with the changing nature of the society and its favorite sports than any specific target. The history of spectator sports in America is filled with rise and fall -- there was a time that horse racing and boxing were two of the top sports in the country. There was a time, not that long ago, that the NBA finals were on tape delay. There was a time that baseball really was the national pastime.

The wheel turns, and things change. Video sports may wind up in the Olympics, and young athletes are choosing lacrosse in larger and larger numbers. It may be that football is on a cyclical downward trend, or it may be that the present controversies are just a blip and the NFL, NCAA and high school football will continue to rule the roost. No question football is a great TV game, which is a major plus, but it will be interesting to see how its popularity fares in the next decade or so.

 

[joebl]

oh brother ... the evil corporations!
Funny how fewer and fewer Americans understand capitalism. Even fewer understand how capitalism has elevated more people to levels never seen before ... but they are soooo greedy! LOL

Lets go back to free market 101 : This football issue is no different than eating at a restaurant. The customers tell you what they want. If you serve lousy food and it makes you sick, either the restaurant changes or goes out of business.
Now put parents, football coaches, AD's, the NFL, NCAA, TV, etc in the place of the customer in the restaurant example and you have reality.

Many, many of those evil CEO's you flippantly disparage give millions to charities around the globe. They drive our incredible economies, improve our lives, including our health, provide jobs, increase incomes ... and on and on. I trust them a billion times more than some unaccountable politician or bureaucrat. It isnt even close.

It is opinions like yours why we have the government telling us what cars we can buy, what toilets we can buy, what light bulbs we can buy, what schools we can attend. Wake up before it is too late.

**I wont quote you since it seems to upset you.**

Free Market 101: The NFL has not been part of the free market since the early 40s. Not only were they tax exempt since 1942, they were granted anti-trust protection back in 1961. While the NFL did give up tax exempt in 2015, it is still protected by antitrust exemptions.

As for NFL being able to police themselves for safety...is this not the same group who tried to hide the effects of concussions?

I dont want the government intruding into things that are not their business, but the government WILL get involved if minors playing football are at significant risk. At this point there is not enough evidence to say it is, but enough to spend $ at research to find out. This funding wont come from the NFL or they would have already done so decades ago. We need the government to help fund this research, and if it takes hearings in Congress to do that, I'm all for it.

 

[joebl]

1.)Source DMV and statistically more sound.
2.) interesting that you believe that education, good parenting and lots of practice can reduce risk in the same uncontrollable circumstances one finds on the football field
3.) Ah yes the argument of convenience. It's your kid and it's up to you to believe you can control factors out of our control. Like weather, other drivers, etc

Suggesting your kid not drive was supposed to open your eyes to the absurdity of it all. Oh well, I whiffed on that one.

As far as statistics, I think you meant to write that of all fatal crashes 6% were 16year olds, not 6% of 16 year olds will be involved.

As far as uncontrollable circumstances - that is another area we look at differently. For example, 1/3 of fatal accidents by 16-19 year olds are caused by unsafe speeds, I believe I can reduce (I'm practical and wont say eliminate) my kids speeding while driving. Also, simply limiting when, where, and even how they drive also lowers the risk. With CTE/Football, we dont know what the risk is nor how to reduce the risk with kids. That is what I want to learn more about and think we should all be supportive of that effort. Until I know more info, I've decided not to take that chance with my kids, but I wont stop another parent from allowing their kids to play.

I do think that with more research we could find that either the CTE issue with HS/Youth football is not very significant or we find out it is. In which case I would predict massive changes to if, when and how the game is played at that level. I hope that we find out soon so that Football doesn't continue to lose its young players.

 

[Lil49erCoach]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry...athletes-to-death_us_5988d42de4b08a4c247f2503

 

[joebl]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry...athletes-to-death_us_5988d42de4b08a4c247f2503

And another today: http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/08/09/concussion-doctor-youth-football-is-child-abuse/

 

[Bubba3000]

And another today: http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/08/09/concussion-doctor-youth-football-is-child-abuse/

Consider the source......

 

[feedback1]

Considering the source - Dr. Omalu is publishing another book on the subject. He is deeply investing in pushing his own theories and conclusions. If you read is conclusions, he is basically calling for the end of football. Here are two other articles that are more balanced.

Inflategate

Plea for timely truth about football's link to brain disease