Is Folsom now a welcome member of the SFL?

[pastyfastquick3]

A few years back there was a huge article in the Sacramento Bee that detailed the complaints of fellow SFL coaches, in attempts to kick Folsom out of the SFL.

https://www.sacbee.com/sports/high-school/joe-davidson/article219497195.html

Now that Folsom has come back down to earth- are they losing enough to be fully accepted into the SFL? I haven't heard any more rumblings about kicking them out since they didn't fully dominate as in years past.

Is it now safe for Folsom to play in this league now that everyone has a shot at a trophy?

Direct from article- “Folsom is so good, it’s from a different planet now, completely out of this atmosphere, and teams around here can’t compete, and sometimes it becomes a safety issue because you have teams going up against guys who are major recruits,” said Rocklin coach Greg Benzel, whose team lost to Folsom by seven touchdowns on Sept. 28."

@MCIC since you were one of the people leading the charge on expelling Folsom- what are your thoughts now?

What makes this article so interesting is the quote from the Oak Ridge HC- “Folsom isn’t breaking rules, but Folsom has a different set of rules than the rest of us,” Oak Ridge coach Eric Cavaliere said. “The open enrollment issue is big. We can’t take any kids into our school unless they live in El Dorado Hills."

What is best about this quote is that it is completely wrong. Even kids who transferred to Folsom to play football, had to move there. No different than if they chose to play at Oak Ridge or Del Oro. It does sound like sour grapes because other programs weren't able to attract the same level of talent, so they lashed out.

Thoughts?

 

[RedZone90]

#FolsomRule

 

[Kickingtee18]

Even kids who transferred to Folsom to play football, had to move there.

Rather worn out topic....especially when quotes like this are not true, not a requirement.

 

[pastyfastquick3]

not a requirement.

Please expand and refute my statement

 

[Kickingtee18]

Please expand and refute my statement

Expand your statement? Being it is incorrect, you should shrink it. There are thousands of cases of athletes attending schools while living outside the school's boundaries - it's called a transfer student (interdistrict). Coach Cavaliere's statement is correct.

 

[pastyfastquick3]

Expand your statement? Being it is incorrect, you should shrink it. There are thousands of cases of athletes attending schools while living outside the school's boundaries - it's called a transfer student (interdistrict). Coach Cavaliere's statement is correct.

So there are Folsom football kids living outside of the school's boundaries? If so, who, and who many?

BTW- All of MDs kids live outside the school's boundaries

 

[Best coast]

A few years back there was a huge article in the Sacramento Bee that detailed the complaints of fellow SFL coaches, in attempts to kick Folsom out of the SFL.

https://www.sacbee.com/sports/high-school/joe-davidson/article219497195.html

Now that Folsom has come back down to earth- are they losing enough to be fully accepted into the SFL? I haven't heard any more rumblings about kicking them out since they didn't fully dominate as in years past.

Is it now safe for Folsom to play in this league now that everyone has a shot at a trophy?

Direct from article- “Folsom is so good, it’s from a different planet now, completely out of this atmosphere, and teams around here can’t compete, and sometimes it becomes a safety issue because you have teams going up against guys who are major recruits,” said Rocklin coach Greg Benzel, whose team lost to Folsom by seven touchdowns on Sept. 28."

@MCIC since you were one of the people leading the charge on expelling Folsom- what are your thoughts now?

What makes this article so interesting is the quote from the Oak Ridge HC- “Folsom isn’t breaking rules, but Folsom has a different set of rules than the rest of us,” Oak Ridge coach Eric Cavaliere said. “The open enrollment issue is big. We can’t take any kids into our school unless they live in El Dorado Hills."

What is best about this quote is that it is completely wrong. Even kids who transferred to Folsom to play football, had to move there. No different than if they chose to play at Oak Ridge or Del Oro. It does sound like sour grapes because other programs weren't able to attract the same level of talent, so they lashed out.

Thoughts?

I kind of agree. Folsom was on a roll for a Few years. Obviously they had some good coaches. They should have scheduled up though. They missed the boat.

 

[colhenrylives]

So there are Folsom football kids living outside of the school's boundaries? If so, who, and who many?

BTW- All of MDs kids live outside the school's boundaries

Great point re MD which has no boundaries.

 

[RS-HonorBowl]

The Honor Bowl offered Folsom a chance to be in 2019 and we wanted to match them up with Centennial. Richardson said 'No way, we have Jesuit on our schedule and DLS!" Folsom has always been hesitant to play up and now that Richardson has moved on, more opportunity might happen to schedule a tough preleague game. In terms of who ends up playing at FHS, that is no concern to me personally. In the CIF-SS there were almost 8,000 people who chose to go to another school in the last year. The commissioners, as much as they try don't have the funds to deal with all the potential litigations. Coach Cav is correct that FHS is an OPEN campus and many of the other teams in the SFL have strict boundaries.

 

[pastyfastquick3]

The Honor Bowl offered Folsom a chance to be in 2019 and we wanted to match them up with Centennial. Richardson said 'No way, we have Jesuit on our schedule and DLS!"

Your post almost came across as credible and not a troll until you forgot the fact that Richardson did not coach Folsom in 2019, nor did he have anything to do with the schedule.

I agree with your premise that no one should care where players come from. Doesn't seem to be an issue in SoCal. And only does in NorCal is you are a public.

With that said- Folsom is not an open campus. Anyone can apply to attend a FCUSD. The problem with this is both Folsom schools are a capacity and have been, on and off, for years now. Why do you think the all of these players have had to move to Folsom? And even IF you move to Folsom and are granted a slot in one of the two Folsom schools, you still have to petition the CIF to be granted athletic eligibility and prove the move wasn't "athletically motivated." This has been the case for years. Folsom was #3 in transfers behind schools like Del Oro and Oak Ridge for YEARS prior to 2018-2019. Why do you think no one ever mentions that? Doesn't fit the narrative of jealous, anonymous users, who wan't people to believe that Folsom won all on luck and outside help. Far from the truth.

Next time you try to troll, at least Google who the coach was in 2019 so some of the other trolls will like more of your posts.

 

[pastyfastquick3]

Great point re MD which has no boundaries.

As I have said before- Everyone cheers MD on to get all the transfers they can get.

A school like Oak Ridge gets ONE and everyone cries foul.

 

[pastyfastquick3]

Folsom was on a roll for a Few years

More like a decade and 4 titles.

 

[Best coast]

More like a decade and 4 titles.

How many state open titles did Folsom win during that decade?

 

[Streak One]

Your post almost came across as credible and not a troll until you forgot the fact that Richardson did not coach Folsom in 2019, nor did he have anything to do with the schedule.

I agree with your premise that no one should care where players come from. Doesn't seem to be an issue in SoCal. And only does in NorCal is you are a public.

With that said- Folsom is not an open campus. Anyone can apply to attend a FCUSD. The problem with this is both Folsom schools are a capacity and have been, on and off, for years now. Why do you think the all of these players have had to move to Folsom? And even IF you move to Folsom and are granted a slot in one of the two Folsom schools, you still have to petition the CIF to be granted athletic eligibility and prove the move wasn't "athletically motivated." This has been the case for years. Folsom was #3 in transfers behind schools like Del Oro and Oak Ridge for YEARS prior to 2018-2019. Why do you think no one ever mentions that? Doesn't fit the narrative of jealous, anonymous users, who wan't people to believe that Folsom won all on luck and outside help. Far from the truth.

Next time you try to troll, at least Google who the coach was in 2019 so some of the other trolls will like more of your posts.

I’m guessing programs start scheduling the year before. So by the end of the 2018 season, did Folsom have no non league games scheduled? Was Doherty handed a blank slate?

I’m not talking about the Honor Bowl claim specifically but rather the point that the previous staff had nothing to do with the 2019 schedule is wrong IMO.

 

[pastyfastquick3]

I’m guessing programs start scheduling the year before.

Thats the problem- guessing. I am not guessing.

So by the end of the 2018 season, did Folsom have no non league games scheduled?

For the most part, no. If you look back on prior years, it has been common for Folsom to be looking for opponents for most of the non-league match up weeks even up to the summer.

Was Doherty handed a blank slate?

For the most part- yes. Richardson knew he was on his way out for a while. I can tell you that the honor bowl post above was a lame attempt at a troll job.

The actual story is Folsom/Cen10 DID talk at some point to hold a game. Folsom has gone to SoCal multiple times over the years and has shown the willingness to do so. I was told Folsom was willing to travel to SoCal but wanted a deal similar to DLS, which was a home/home for each team, back to back years. Cen10 stated from the get go that they would not travel under any circumstances. The honor bowl offer for a farce if you even want to call it that. Look where it was to be held- San Diego! Go figure. Do you think if the Honor Bowl was held in Sacramento, Cen10 would be chomping at the bit to play Folsom? Doubtful. So, how genuine is this "request to play?"

Cen10 has played some great competition, no doubt. They are a great program, no doubt. But they haven't exactly had to travel out of their own neighborhood to get top flight games. You can interpret it however you want, but those are the facts.

Do you think any boxer in the world is going to agree to fight someone for the heavy weight title with terms of- "fight to be held in my home country and not yours for the main fight AND possible rematch, it is what it is, so sign it, or you are a wimp!" We need to be realistic here. Nobody, in any sport, will agree to those terms. And if they do, they are lying.

The only schools up north that may agree to those terms are the little guys, playing on Saturdays, that may need some notoriety, because they are not well-known like Folsom.....Say a school like Marin Catholic.

When you have a decade of dominance as Folsom has, you simply have enough leverage to be on at least an equal footing with any school that wants to play. I think you would agree.

 

[RedZone90]

Then how is it possible that Cen10 has played De La Salle more times than Foolsome? Makes no sense. I think you would agree.

 

[ararar]

Do you think any boxer in the world is going to agree to fight someone for the heavy weight title with terms of- "fight to be held in my home country and not yours for the main fight AND possible rematch, it is what it is, so sign it, or you are a wimp!" We need to be realistic here. Nobody, in any sport, will agree to those terms. And if they do, they are lying.

The only schools up north that may agree to those terms are the little guys, playing on Saturdays, that may need some notoriety, because they are not well-known like Folsom.....Say a school like Marin Catholic.

Except Pittsburg did it so yeah Folsom’s a wimp

 

[ararar]

Thats the problem- guessing. I am not guessing.

For the most part, no. If you look back on prior years, it has been common for Folsom to be looking for opponents for most of the non-league match up weeks even up to the summer.

For the most part- yes. Richardson knew he was on his way out for a while. I can tell you that the honor bowl post above was a lame attempt at a troll job.

The actual story is Folsom/Cen10 DID talk at some point to hold a game. Folsom has gone to SoCal multiple times over the years and has shown the willingness to do so. I was told Folsom was willing to travel to SoCal but wanted a deal similar to DLS, which was a home/home for each team, back to back years. Cen10 stated from the get go that they would not travel under any circumstances. The honor bowl offer for a farce if you even want to call it that. Look where it was to be held- San Diego! Go figure. Do you think if the Honor Bowl was held in Sacramento, Cen10 would be chomping at the bit to play Folsom? Doubtful. So, how genuine is this "request to play?"

Cen10 has played some great competition, no doubt. They are a great program, no doubt. But they haven't exactly had to travel out of their own neighborhood to get top flight games. You can interpret it however you want, but those are the facts.

Do you think any boxer in the world is going to agree to fight someone for the heavy weight title with terms of- "fight to be held in my home country and not yours for the main fight AND possible rematch, it is what it is, so sign it, or you are a wimp!" We need to be realistic here. Nobody, in any sport, will agree to those terms. And if they do, they are lying.

The only schools up north that may agree to those terms are the little guys, playing on Saturdays, that may need some notoriety, because they are not well-known like Folsom.....Say a school like Marin Catholic.

When you have a decade of dominance as Folsom has, you simply have enough leverage to be on at least an equal footing with any school that wants to play. I think you would agree.

Now explain to us why the same demands of a return game were not expected of Chaminade?

 

[CaliforniaFan24]

When you look at California high school football the last decade you have MD and SJB on top, with DLS just below them. Then Centennial Corona; you have to put Folsom below CC simply because of the huge difference in quallty opponents each of those teams played.

 

[pastyfastquick3]

Now explain to us why the same demands of a return game were not expected of Chaminade?

That's an easy one. Did you not see the beating Chaminade took against Folsom in SoCal? Got 70 dropped on them in a game where Folsom could have scored 100? Would you want a return game with that team and have to go up north?

Fun fact- That agreement originally included a return game.

Funny how all these SoCal school's can't travel north, yet it is expected to come South for the North teams.

Beatings are hard to accept sometime.

 

[pastyfastquick3]

Except Pittsburg did it so yeah Folsom’s a wimp

Pittsburg agreed to that because they are a mid tier NorCal team and wanted that match up.

A team/program like Folsom is a tier 1 NorCal team and doesn't need to agree to a multi year "travel to Corona" agreement when the other school states- "no travel." Both are public schools. If Folsom can find a way to get South, Cen10 can find a way to get North. Cen10 chickened out.

If the hundreds of SoCal transfers can find a way to travel around SoCal to attend multiple schools during a 4 year period, I am sure the programs down there can accommodate a little travel up north for them.

 

[pastyfastquick3]

Then Centennial Corona; you have to put Folsom below CC simply because of the huge difference in quallty opponents each of those teams played.

CA Public Schools over the last decade.
1. Folsom (state titles, record against SoCal, travel to SoCal)
2. Cen10 (no state titles, refusal to travel).

The judges on the panel determine that Folsom is the best public of the last decade.

BTW- This is the second brand new name to pop up on this thread alone. I must be popular as a school playing on Saturdays during the day!

 

[ararar]

That's an easy one. Did you not see the beating Chaminade took against Folsom in SoCal? Got 70 dropped on them in a game where Folsom could have scored 100? Would you want a return game with that team and have to go up north?

Fun fact- That agreement originally included a return game.

Funny how all these SoCal school's can't travel north, yet it is expected to come South for the North teams.

Beatings are hard to accept sometime.

No it did not include a return game
Trying to save face by lying is your MO
So as we all already knew Folsom didn’t want any of Centennial so they demanded a stipulation they knew wasn’t on the table.
Folsom made a nice little name for themselves by strategically dodging opponents they should have played and honestly I’m not against that strategy.
I am against pretending that It didn’t happen

 

[pastyfastquick3]

No it did not include a return game
Trying to save face by lying is your MO
So as we all already knew Folsom didn’t want any of Centennial so they demanded a stipulation they knew wasn’t on the table.
Folsom made a nice little name for themselves by strategically dodging opponents they should have played and honestly I’m not against that strategy.
I am against pretending that It didn’t happen

Would you want a return game after getting 70 dropped on you at home? Case closed. I'd ask to get out of it too lol. At least they agreed to a game unlike Cen10. At least Chaminade had some nuts!

I tnink any rational football fan would agree that any stipulation for an agreement for two top teams to play, when one side includes "no traveling" in the stipulation, is unreasonable in 2020. No team in America holds that kind of leverage, not even the top privates.

Bottom line is Cen10 wanted no part of Folsom after seeing a few of the beatings other SoCal teams took and demanded a stipulation that no top team would agree to.

You can call it "wussin out" in a wuss kind of way by acting like you want a game but instead presenting terms that are so unreasonable that no team worth a poop would ever agree too.

Folsom is therefore determined the winner of the #1 public in CA over the last decade.....and they never lost to a SD team like Cen10 did at home!

 

[ararar]

I tnink any rational football fan would agree that any stipulation for an agreement for two top teams to play, when one side includes "no traveling" in the stipulation, is unreasonable in 2020. No team in America holds that kind of leverage, not even the top privates.

Except every public team in Texas who play national schedules do this exact thing(DONT travel to return games) you must go to Texas Just ask DLS.Yet they get big time opponents every year because great teams want to challenge themselves.
I’m not knocking Folsom for their strategy I’m knocking you for lying about it

 

[CaliforniaFan24]

Still cannot see how anyone can put Folsom on a par with Centennial Corona. i mean, CC has been very close to MD and SJB this past decade, and we know that SJB and MD would have beaten Folsom even worse than the whippings that DLS put on Folsom.

It seems strange to even think that Folsom would be considered on a par with CC. Remember, the reason CC has no state titles is that they had to go thru SJB and MD every year, plus the only real state title that counts is the Open Game title.

 

[RedZone90]

Still cannot see how anyone can put Folsom on a par with Centennial Corona. i mean, CC has been very close to MD and SJB this past decade, and we know that SJB and MD would have beaten Folsom even worse than the whippings that DLS put on Folsom.

It seems strange to even think that Folsom would be considered on a par with CC. Remember, the reason CC has no state titles is that they had to go thru SJB and MD every year, plus the only real state title that counts is the Open Game title.

The Folsom Troll knows everything you’ve said here is true. He’s just doing what trolls do and he’ll likely be banned again soon enough. He fears Folsom’s run is coming to an end and needs to try to make Folsom relevant before DLS and Monterey Trail spank them again this year. Maybe other programs will too. LOL...

 

[pastyfastquick3]

Great conversation guys! Nothing gets me more fired up than talk about HSFB with fellow passionites!

A few quick points to end the conversation, as I think they are important.

1. An excuse of "not being able to get through MD or SJB" is about the same as "not being able to get through DLS." Nobody is giving Folsom a pass, so Cen10 does not get a pass.

2. Folsom travels. Cen10 has publicly stated they do not...ever.

3. Folsom is undefeated against SoCal competition. This is relevant, as we have a very limited pool to judge Cen10 off of, due to lack of traveling outside of the general area. If you don't think they're SoCal competition was elite...fine. Get someone to come up and play them. So far, no one has offered to travel to play them. Folsom has offered to travel multiple times and shown the willingness to do so.

4. Folsom never lost to a San Diego team. Cen10 got embarrassed at home to a mid tier San Diego team who turned around and got smashed against another San Diego team the next week. Not very impressive considering Folsom has beaten BOTH of those SD teams....1 of em twice!

We can argue all day, but bottom line is this- Folsom is the best public school in CA over the last decade. Not disputable.

Just thankful we are in the conversation. It could always be worse. We could be playing small coastal teams in the playoffs on Saturdays in the middle of a neighborhood. That would be no fun! Embrace the spotlight guys!

 

[BigMann08]

Interesting conversation! Folsom has definitely carved a name for itself and they have proven to be a great program. I can't quite put them on the same level as Centennial, which is no knock against Folsom, but rather respecting the level of competition that Centennial has faced and sought out.

In the past decade, Centennial has played national powerhouses: SJB, MD, Gorman, IMG, DLS, Chandler, etc. They have also managed to beat SJB, MD, Chandler and be competitive with DLS and IMG. They have not ducked competition, even in defeat.

Let's not also forget that Centennial left the Inland Empire Division, which they had dominated quite frequently, and joined the Pac 5 division, (arguably the best division in the nation) and have enjoyed great success; winning multiple Pac 5 Championships.

If it is true, that Folsom had the opportunity to play Centennial (in San Diego) but declined the invitation, then that should be considered a duck.

The Bulldogs should have taken on the challenge by storming into San Diego and beating Centennial. A win against Centennial would have strengthened Folsom's resume. We cant deny it, Folsom had some dynamite teams this past decade, but they did very little to secure their name amongst the greats. Quite frankly, we don't know how great some of those team were. We will never really know because they were not tested. From all reports the CIF Open Play in Game was eliminated because DLS was too dominant and Folsom wasn't given the opportunity to showcase against a lesser - more comparable talent. Well, that wish was granted and as a result the Bulldogs had much success against Chaminade, who was probably the equivalent of playing another Nor Cal or SJS powerhouse.

The weak scheduling, ducking Centennial, complaining about the Play-in-game (even if done inadvertently) puts Folsom as the #2 public school in the state behind Centennial. #2 is not bad.

 

[concrete17]

Interesting conversation! Folsom has definitely carved a name for itself and they have proven to be a great program. I can't quite put them on the same level as Centennial, which is no knock against Folsom, but rather respecting the level of competition that Centennial has faced and sought out.

In the past decade, Centennial has played national powerhouses: SJB, MD, Gorman, IMG, DLS, Chandler, etc. They have also managed to beat SJB, MD, Chandler and be competitive with DLS and IMG. They have not ducked competition, even in defeat.

Let's not also forget that Centennial left the Inland Empire Division, which they had dominated quite frequently, and joined the Pac 5 division, (arguably the best division in the nation) and have enjoyed great success; winning multiple Pac 5 Championships.

If it is true, that Folsom had the opportunity to play Centennial (in San Diego) but declined the invitation, then that should be considered a duck.

The Bulldogs should have taken on the challenge by storming into San Diego and beating Centennial. A win against Centennial would have strengthened Folsom's resume. We cant deny it, Folsom had some dynamite teams this past decade, but they did very little to secure their name amongst the greats. Quite frankly, we don't know how great some of those team were. We will never really know because they were not tested. From all reports the CIF Open Play in Game was eliminated because DLS was too dominant and Folsom wasn't given the opportunity to showcase against a lesser - more comparable talent. Well, that wish was granted and as a result the Bulldogs had much success against Chaminade, who was probably the equivalent of playing another Nor Cal or SJS powerhouse.

The weak scheduling, ducking Centennial, complaining about the Play-in-game (even if done inadvertently) puts Folsom as the #2 public school in the state behind Centennial. #2 is not bad.

Cen-10 also spanked my Spartans in the 2008 SBG Div-1 matchup 22-16 which DeLa avenged 4 years later in another meeting, the Open Division this time, 48-28

 

[pastyfastquick3]

Interesting conversation! Folsom has definitely carved a name for itself and they have proven to be a great program. I can't quite put them on the same level as Centennial, which is no knock against Folsom, but rather respecting the level of competition that Centennial has faced and sought out.

In the past decade, Centennial has played national powerhouses: SJB, MD, Gorman, IMG, DLS, Chandler, etc. They have also managed to beat SJB, MD, Chandler and be competitive with DLS and IMG. They have not ducked competition, even in defeat.

Let's not also forget that Centennial left the Inland Empire Division, which they had dominated quite frequently, and joined the Pac 5 division, (arguably the best division in the nation) and have enjoyed great success; winning multiple Pac 5 Championships.

If it is true, that Folsom had the opportunity to play Centennial (in San Diego) but declined the invitation, then that should be considered a duck.

The Bulldogs should have taken on the challenge by storming into San Diego and beating Centennial. A win against Centennial would have strengthened Folsom's resume. We cant deny it, Folsom had some dynamite teams this past decade, but they did very little to secure their name amongst the greats. Quite frankly, we don't know how great some of those team were. We will never really know because they were not tested. From all reports the CIF Open Play in Game was eliminated because DLS was too dominant and Folsom wasn't given the opportunity to showcase against a lesser - more comparable talent. Well, that wish was granted and as a result the Bulldogs had much success against Chaminade, who was probably the equivalent of playing another Nor Cal or SJS powerhouse.

The weak scheduling, ducking Centennial, complaining about the Play-in-game (even if done inadvertently) puts Folsom as the #2 public school in the state behind Centennial. #2 is not bad.

Great conversation!

But to clarify, it was Cen10 who declined an invitation to play Folsom. Folsom gladly accepted the shot to play Cen10 on a home/home basis, 1 in SoCal, 1 in Norcal. Cen10 stated that "they do not travel, and that games would only be played in SoCal." They would have accepted the home/home only if it meant that BOTH games were at Cen10 in SoCal. Kind of disingenuous if you ask me. They didn't really WANT to play so to speak.

There is nothing wrong with Cen10 being #2 for public schools in CA over the last decade. I think that point was driven home last year when they lost to a San Diego team at home who turned around and got blown out by another San Diego team. Not a good look.

Bulldogs take the crown.

 

[BigMann08]

Cen-10 also spanked my Spartans in the 2008 SBG Div-1 matchup 22-16 which DeLa avenged 4 years later in another meeting, the Open Division this time, 48-28

Indeed! I remember watching both games on TV.

The fact that Cen10 actually beat DLS, SJB, and MD speaks volumes. I think the new age rise of MD and SJB can be attributed to DLS/Cen10. MD/SJB changed up their athletic makeup after catching L's from (DLS/Cen10).

 

[BigMann08]

Great conversation!

But to clarify, it was Cen10 who declined an invitation to play Folsom. Folsom gladly accepted the shot to play Cen10 on a home/home basis, 1 in SoCal, 1 in Norcal. Cen10 stated that "they do not travel, and that games would only be played in SoCal." They would have accepted the home/home only if it meant that BOTH games were at Cen10 in SoCal. Kind of disingenuous if you ask me. They didn't really WANT to play so to speak.

There is nothing wrong with Cen10 being #2 for public schools in CA over the last decade. I think that point was driven home last year when they lost to a San Diego team at home who turned around and got blown out by another San Diego team. Not a good look.

Bulldogs take the crown.

So Im confused, was there an invitation to play Cen10 at the Honor Bowl in San Diego? And if so, did Folsom decline that invitation?

Also Folsom lost to Monterey Trails last year. Sac High and St. Mary's in 2016. Bellarmine Prep in 2015. Vacaville in 2011. None of these defeats were against teams that were considered State/national powerhouses.

They also suffered humiliating defeats against DLS in 2012 and 2013. While we can speculate a vast improvement in 2014, they didn't beat any top tier talent. The lost of the Open Play in Game, in my opinion, keeps Folsom out of #1 contention. The CIF changed the rules to accommodate Folsom and or Nor Cal representation.

This does not fair well for SJS/Nor Cal football. We should be competing for the Open Championships.

 

[pastyfastquick3]

So Im confused, was there an invitation to play Cen10 at the Honor Bowl in San Diego? And if so, did Folsom decline that invitation?

Nobody declined anything. Cen10 declined to travel to NorCal to play Folsom. Folsom offered to travel to SoCal, but on the basis that the favor would be returned the next year. Cen10 declined.

An honor bowl invite (which there wasn't) would have been disingenuous at best, considering the only reason Cen10 was offering because it was a chance to get Folsom to SoCal without any obligation for return travel.

While I agree with some of what you said- the notion of "we should all be competing for open titles," is also a bit disingenuous, considering the landscape and lack of transfer rules in the South. The North barely has half of the population and schools that SoCal does, while operating under a completely different set of rules. Look at DLS the last 3 years- completely smoked in all the open games. The gap is becoming wider.

Still doesn't change that Folsom is the #1 public in the state for the last decade. I don't care who you played in SoCal, simply due to proximity, you still didn't win anything. Just going off "what if's" and "level of competition" is pure speculation.

Folsom #1 public over Centennial.

 

[BigMann08]

Nobody declined anything. Cen10 declined to travel to NorCal to play Folsom. Folsom offered to travel to SoCal, but on the basis that the favor would be returned the next year. Cen10 declined.

An honor bowl invite (which there wasn't) would have been disingenuous at best, considering the only reason Cen10 was offering because it was a chance to get Folsom to SoCal without any obligation for return travel.

While I agree with some of what you said- the notion of "we should all be competing for open titles," is also a bit disingenuous, considering the landscape and lack of transfer rules in the South. The North barely has half of the population and schools that SoCal does, while operating under a completely different set of rules. Look at DLS the last 3 years- completely smoked in all the open games. The gap is becoming wider.

Still doesn't change that Folsom is the #1 public in the state for the last decade. I don't care who you played in SoCal, simply due to proximity, you still didn't win anything. Just going off "what if's" and "level of competition" is pure speculation.

Folsom #1 public over Centennial.

Folsom has benefitted from the transfer rule. Families are not exempt from utilizing it. Have they not? If yes, they have have had access to kids from all over Sac Metro, which from all accounts is a population that well exceeds 2 million people.

In my opinion the #1 public school in CA should be competing for the Open State Championships and not hiding behind the notion of the transfer rule, or the population size. Let's not forget that a Sacramento Metro team has won the Open State championship game. And they did it in style. Why should Folsom bid for anything less? Especially being that they are, as you put it, the #1 public in the State.

I've already highlighted that Cen10 has beaten the top 3 privates in the state. Well in this past decade, 2 of the top 3 privates. And with the addition of your concession, we can agree that MD and SJB are a step ahead of DLS. Primarily because DLS hasn't adopted the the MD/SJB formula; which if they chose to do so, would level the playing field. For they have access to the same type of kids.



Folsom has attracted kids from across the region. And we must respect the fact that Sacramento is a long time football hotbed with access to kids that rival MD and SJB.

 

[pastyfastquick3]

Folsom has benefitted from the transfer rule. Families are not exempt from utilizing it. Have they not? If yes, they have have had access to kids from all over Sac Metro, which from all accounts is a population that well exceeds 2 million people.

They have received some local transfers, as have every single top program in NorCal. Funny thing about that is Folsom was 2-3 in the SFL in total transfers during most of the decade. A dirty little secret in that area.
All 3 Ngata brothers were not transfers.
Browning was not a transfer.
The notion that Folsom is "only good because of transfers" is usually the fallback for posters on this site. Disingenuous at best, as the facts dispute this.
If "transferring to Folsom to play football" were that easy, you wouldn't have people moving there just to do so. The comments from trolls insinuating that Folsom has "open enrollment" is one of the biggest lies on this forum. When they are pressed on the facts of what "open enrollment" truly means, they usually just revert back to whatever troll line is trending on the forum that day. Facts matter.

In my opinion the #1 public school in CA should be competing for the Open State Championships and not hiding behind the notion of the transfer rule, or the population size.

I am glad that is your opinion. But nobody is hiding. When is the last time you saw a public school in the Open SBG? I shall wait.

Let's not forget that a Sacramento Metro team has won the Open State championship game.

I remember that. I watched and followed that Grant team all the way. The same team that Folsom beat the next year and eliminated in the SJS title game on the way to their first state title.

Especially being that they are, as you put it, the #1 public in the State.

Yes, #1 public in CA over the last decade.

I've already highlighted that Cen10 has beaten the top 3 privates in the state.

That's great Zero titles. And even putting them in the 1AA title game every year and assuming they would win is suspect at best, considering what I saw last year in the loss to mediocre Cathedral.

And we must respect the fact that Sacramento is a long time football hotbed with access to kids that rival MD and SJB.

If you think the access to kids in the Sacramento area, rivals the talent pool of what SJB and MD are drawing from, you need to stop smoking that purple sticky icky immediately.

I appreciate the fun though. This has been great.

 

[BigMann08]

Transfers: I have no problem with kids transferring, moving from out of town to attend a school, driving across town for a better opportunity, or getting an apartment down the street from a football powerhouse. It's all good with me! Families do that all over the country. It's an old practice. These kids still didn't beat De la Salle. These kids didn't take them to the next level.

Public- Open Bowl Participants: In the 11 years of the State
Open Games 5 public school teams have participated: Grant, LBP, Crenshaw, Westlake, Cen10 x3). Cent10 went 3X's and was the last school to participate in 2015.) (Which in my opinion sets them apart from all other public schools.) One team missing from this list is Folsom. The Bulldogs have never competed at the highest level. Well I take that back, they did, but they got annihilated by DLS. Couldn't even move the chains.

Moral of the story...

1) Cen10 dominated the IE and was rewarded with the Pac5. Folsom dominated the SJS and was rewarded with the 1AA state championship game aka "Get out of De la Salle" free card.

2) The IE is flooded with talent! Cen10's dominance forced SJB and MD to turn their programs into LA Showcase teams. Both Parochial schools started using the SoCal basketball formula...

Corrrection:

The Bulldogs did not face Grant in 2009. They beat Grant in 2010. Those 2009-10 teams did not have a 6-4 220 pound QB leading them lol. I still believe that Folsom hasn't beat anyone special since 2010!

 

[Best coast]

All very good points Bigman. Remember back when the state bowl games first started there was only 3 divisions. Both public schools Canyon Country and Cent10 beat DLS in the D1 game. Although Folsom had some good teams they never beat one of the big boys.

 

[BigMann08]

Indeed! Those were some good games. Canyon shocked the world! And Cen10 had a great team on 08. Very special group!

Folsom has a great program as well. And I wish them nothing but success.

 

[ThunderRam]

The Bulldogs have never competed at the highest level. Well I take that back, they did, but they got annihilated by DLS. Couldn't even move the chains.

Assume you are only referring to the Regional games? Cause that's obviously true.

But in the games they've scheduled they competed well to the final whistle in 2018 and had their best offensive output against DLS last season scoring 27.

Public- Open Bowl Participants: In the 11 years of the State
Open Games 5 public school teams have participated: Grant, LBP, Crenshaw, Westlake, Cen10 x3). Cent10 went 3X's and was the last school to participate in 2015.) (Which in my opinion sets them apart from all other public schools.)

I contend that Grant Union has set itself apart, too, as the only public to actually win the Open division.

But, yes, Cen10's three appearances surely are an impressive feat as well. If for no other reason, they had to win the PAC5/D1 -- arguably one of the toughest, if not the toughest, playoff brackets in the Nation -- in order to earn 2 out of those 3 appearances.

Corrrection:

The Bulldogs did not face Grant in 2009. They beat Grant in 2010. Those 2009-10 teams did not have a 6-4 220 pound QB leading them lol. I still believe that Folsom hasn't beat anyone special since 2010!

It's fair to point out that Grant Union also beat Folsom in 2010. Absolutely destroyed them with a completely healthy roster. Everyone knows the circumstances of the Section Final rematch, which has been discussed ad nauseam over the years.

If Folsom and Grant Union had managed to match up in 2009, I'm pretty sure the result would have been worse than the 49-14 beat down Folsom suffered to begin the next season (remember, this Pacers team went up to Seattle and shut out eventual WA State Champ Bellevue 14-0).

Folsom's defense was especially porous in 2009 and quite vulnerable to a physically punishing rush attack, as Del Oro and Bryce Pratt proved when he rushed for 345 yards and 4 TD's in overcoming a 35-7 deficit. Devontae Booker and the Pacers big, fast, athletic line would have had a field day. The Pacers didn't have Booker in 2010.

Folsom learned a little something about themselves after Del Oro physically beat them up and went out and hired Max Miller in an attempt to improve in that area. They weren't a tremendous defensive team in 2010, but they were certainly much improved. But IMO still not as good as a healthy Pacers team, who BTW wasn't as good offensively as they had been in 2008 or 2009.

FWIW, I think the best teams Folsom has beaten since first coming to prominence in 2009 are 2010 Grant Union, 2010 Serra-Gardena, 2015 Clayton Valley Charter, 2017 Helix, 2017 Central-Fresno, 2018 Central-Fresno.

Of that list, only the 2010 Pacers were ever considered a special team, who, according to CalHi were once ranked No. 1 in the state and No. 4 in the nation.

So with regard to your last point, I wholeheartedly agree.