Carondelet 70 MM66

[mkbgdns]

very enjoyable and closely contested game. MM led most of the first three quarters, with Clet opening 4Q with a spurt to go 5 up, and holding on despite MM pulling close several times.

of interest to me, MM played a very effective player-to-player much of the game, despite giving up size, sometimes substantial size, at every position. in the first part of the game,they hung with their opponent on the boards. their attempts to press yielded more easy finishes than turnovers, but they had to mix up the tempo, Clet holding the cards for a grind-it-out half court contest.

in crucial final minutes, Clet dominated their offensive boards, and defense denied MM good shot opportunities. Clet earned this one.

 

[Paytc]

very enjoyable and closely contested game. MM led most of the first three quarters, with Clet opening 4Q with a spurt to go 5 up, and holding on despite MM pulling close several times.

of interest to me, MM played a very effective player-to-player much of the game, despite giving up size, sometimes substantial size, at every position. in the first part of the game,they hung with their opponent on the boards. their attempts to press yielded more easy finishes than turnovers, but they had to mix up the tempo, Clet holding the cards for a grind-it-out half court contest.

in crucial final minutes, Clet dominated their offensive boards, and defense denied MM good shot opportunities. Clet earned this one.

It sounds like I missed a good game. But at the same time it appeared to have been the same tough game with the outcome I expected based on the size, depth, and experience advantage Clet has. They may not want to see MM later in the season once MM gains more continuity. But at the same time (this season's Clet will also most likely keep improving). What I think we're seeing is Carondelet (this season) is able to win in more than just the games they are favored to win. And this year already they have proved they can win in close games and even pull off upsets. Something they only managed to do once in the prior 4 seasons when they went to SMS and pulled off the shocker. This sets up the stage for Clet vs Mater Dei at the Nike TOC. Not sure how that game or the Nike TOC will go. But I think we are seeing a Carondelet team that's gonna give @SMS 1/5, Pinewood (1/9 and possibly @WCJ), Mitty 1/21, and Salesian in the most likely rematch in the 2nd round of the WCJ, all tough games. And of course they may even for the first time ( depending on the seedings and who they draw) win their first round Open Division contest, and perhaps more. Congratulations to Clet and best wishes at the Nike TOC.

 

[Passionatedad]

It sounds like I missed a good game. But at the same time it appeared to have been the same tough game with the outcome I expected based on the size, depth, and experience advantage Clet has. What I think we're seeing is Carondelet (this season) is able to win in more than just the games they are favored to win. And this year already they have proved they can win in close games and even pull off upsets. Something they only managed to do once in the prior 4 seasons when they went to SMS and pulled off the shocker. This sets up the stage for Clet vs Mater Dei at the Nike TOC. Not sure how that game or the Nike TOC will go. But I think we are seeing a Carondelet team that's gonna give @SMS 1/5, Pinewood (1/9 and possibly @WCJ), Mitty 1/21, and Salesian in the most likely rematch in the 2nd round of the WCJ all tough games. and of course they may even for the first time win their first round Open Division contest. Congratulations to Clet and best wishes at the Nike TOC.

This should be carondelets year. After this year it's going to be a reality check for their new coaching staff.

 

[Paytc]

This should be carondelets year. After this year it's going to be a reality check for their new coaching staff.

All he can do is the best he can do with the cards he's dealt. He didn't have the advantage of being in place the past 3 or 4 years to start building his pipeline and developing his return players. And unfortunately the person in place before him didn't maximize or develop players, and cut off and drained the pipeline. I think if Mike Morris aka MM can pull off a few upsets this season, he will attract a few players that he might miss out on if he and Clet doesn't pull off a few upsets. And I think he will have better return players and talent coming in than most are giving him credit for having. And based on the fact that he's not the scary type of worrying about what other teams have instead the we're gonna make the best of what we have type of coach, he and Clet next season will end up surprising many folks. They will be young, but still a talented group next season, just wait and see. Meanwhile, he'll be focused on cashing in this season. And making the best of this season, and each and every game and season, bring em, as they come in the future. Congratulations to Clet !

 

[mkbgdns]

Clet might be the best bay area team not named after a clergyman or a forest.

 

[Pbacoach]

This should be carondelets year. After this year it's going to be a reality check for their new coaching staff.

How do you know what will happen next yr? C-let will be fine coach Morris will figure it out. He has a great basketball background.

 

[mkbgdns]

PD might be looking for company as an SMS fan even though they don't come better than Coach Gonzalves. on the other hand, Clet started 5 seniors. their tide is definitely in. it's a little early to be talking about next year. granted, players like decosta and bamburger usually don't have a sister a few years younger in the wings. unless her name is Ogwumike.

seems early to throw shade on Clet's coach, he did a fine job of managing his resources last night.

and hey! the handle MM is trademarked!

 

[Pbacoach]

PD might be looking for company as an SMS fan even though they don't come better than Coach Gonzalves. on the other hand, Clet started 5 seniors. their tide is definitely in. it's a little early to be talking about next year. granted, players like decosta and bamburger usually don't have a sister a few years younger in the wings. unless her name is Ogwumike.

seems early to throw shade on Clet's coach, he did a fine job of managing his resources last night.

and hey! the handle MM is trademarked!

Exactly my point. It is to early to determine where any program will be next yr. They beat a tough MM team that is well coached.

 

[Paytc]

PD might be looking for company as an SMS fan even though they don't come better than Coach Gonzalves. on the other hand, Clet started 5 seniors. their tide is definitely in. it's a little early to be talking about next year. granted, players like decosta and bamburger usually don't have a sister a few years younger in the wings. unless her name is Ogwumike.

seems early to throw shade on Clet's coach, he did a fine job of managing his resources last night.

and hey! the handle MM is trademarked!

mkbgdns,

Hey he's never loss to MM so he took the trademark until the former MM can take it back. Smile.

And both SMS and Carondelet were good long before Decosta and Bambeger. So they both will find a way to continue on after they both have moved along. Like they did after Chelsey Grey and Jayne Appel two awesome WNBA players.

Pbacoach,

Many are under estimating Coach Mike Morris. It only took me watching him coach twice to know Carondelet definitely upgraded their coaching staff from the prior 4 years. And depending on how long he stays, IMO he may end up being the best coach they ever had. In terms of winning state championships, exceeding expectations, and providing an experience that will be with and benefit his players long after they have left his coaching experience. This year's team is very fortunate to have him. Much success to the new coach for this and every season he decides to coach the team.

 

[OnBall8]

IMO he may end up being the best coach they ever had

Easy there... one month into his tenure is a little early to be saying he might be better than the great Margaret Gartner. She sustained excellence there long enough that she deserves more respect than that. The new guy came in with a good squad.. the true test won't be next year either. Lets see 3-4 years from now how things have gone before coach Gartner gets the boot from the top

 

[Norcal_Fan]

mkbgdns,

Hey he's never loss to MM so he took the trademark until the former MM can take it back. Smile.

And both SMS and Carondelet were good long before Decosta and Bambeger. So they both will find a way to continue on after they both have moved along. Like they did after Chelsey Grey and Jayne Appel two awesome WNBA players.

Pbacoach,

Many are under estimating Coach Mike Morris. It only took me watching him coach twice to know Carondelet definitely upgraded their coaching staff from the prior 4 years. And depending on how long he stays, IMO he may end up being the best coach they ever had. In terms of winning state championships, exceeding expectations, and providing an experience that will be with and benefit his players long after they have left his coaching experience. This year's team is very fortunate to have him. Much success to the new coach for this and every season he decides to coach the team.

Wow...all that from 2 games? Pay I love your posts but I think you're putting the horse in front of the cart. Before you go crowning Coach Morris as the head pontiff, lets give him 2-3 years to really get things going. Technically, this is still Elgin's team. Once Morris. gets his own players then we can really judge what kind of coach he is. . So far, on paper, he looks to be doing a great job!

 

[OnBall8]

I guess we cant forget that paytc will take any chance he can to make backhanded comments towards elgin.. the man has some disdain for the prior coach

 

[mkbgdns]

http://www.prep2prep.com/feature.aspx?ArticleID=25575

 

[Paytc]

Wow...all that from 2 games? Pay I love your posts but I think you're putting the horse in front of the cart. Before you go crowning Coach Morris as the head pontiff, lets give him 2-3 years to really get things going. Technically, this is still Elgin's team. Once Morris. gets his own players then we can really judge what kind of coach he is. . So far, on paper, he looks to be doing a great job!

Norcal,

I said he was an upgrade from Elgin and... (I won't bite my tongue on that because he is already in almost every way IMO) And I said "if" he stays long enough he "may" become the best Carondelet coach ever. Records are made to be broken. And opinions are made to be spoken. Some say things far more ridiculous than that like.... Lebron is better than Kobe and Jordan. Even though he keeps bouncing around ( with the league's help) to team after team to build instant all star teams instead of putting the work in with one team and going through the ups and down times.

I've seen the 3 coaches in question. And based on my belief ( and my opinion) that coaching styles that are timid and less aggressive are not as good as the more aggressive type makes me give this guy an early edge. I'm a Margaret fan. I never said he was a better coach than Margaret who was a very good coach. However what Margaret did to my knowledge in her close to 30 years was win 1 state championship with Jayne Appel and company. Not to knock her, but I think if you gave any good coach close to 30 years at Carondelet they could also win a state championship or two and dominate league. Winning league games (135-2) when your team is clearly better isn't all that impressive to me. I judge things on winning 50/50 games, under dog games, and championships. And the experience during and after being positive for those you coach. So far only championships is lacking for the new guy. Sure it may take time to win a championship or two. Good luck at the Nike TOC and beyond.

And those that would want to knock the new coach and claim that he is working with Margaret's recruits (because Bamberger and company came to the team after the legacy that Margaret built, not Elgin) those same people would say Steve Kerr was a great coach after he took over after Mark Jackson helped build and drive the Warriors to the championship door step. And they never missed a beat when Luke Walton coached the team during Kerr's absence.

Best wishes for Carondelet at the Nike TOC ! Smile

 

[Pbacoach]

Roasted

 

[mkbgdns]

However what Margaret did to my knowledge in her close to 30 years was win 1 state championship

uh, she "did" a whole lot more than that. you are exhibiting a very limited definition of accomplishment. I'm guessing you weren't paying much attention to Clet before your daughter became a possible enrollee. they've been on my radar for 25 years, and a consistent model of success. yes, including the last few years.

"Not to knock her but..." yeah, there goes the knock. it's called "damning with faint praise." c'mon dude, own it. you feel entitled to Coach Gonsalves or Coach Phillips. or, if you go back that far, Coach Nakamura. unfortunately, each is one of a kind.

 

[Paytc]

uh, she "did" a whole lot more than that. you are exhibiting a very limited definition of accomplishment. I'm guessing you weren't paying much attention to Clet before your daughter became a possible enrollee. they've been on my radar for 25 years, and a consistent model of success. yes, including the last few years.

"Not to knock her but..." yeah, there goes the knock. it's called "damning with faint praise." c'mon dude, own it. you feel entitled to Coach Gonsalves or Coach Phillips. or, if you go back that far, Coach Nakamura. unfortunately, each is one of a kind.

You can use any semantics you like to sum up what I say even though it's the truth. I dam your faint of me too, so what? I own everything I say. I said in essence that Elgin was an ok coach nothing special. And that Margaret was a very good coach. I also said what she accomplished could be surpassed. Why should anyone coach or play the game if they weren't aiming to push the boundaries of accomplishment further and further? I also said Michael Jordan was a bit over rated. Did that mean I didn't respect or think he was an awesome player? That too was why I loved Kobe and Allen Iverson. Because they both had major respect and love for Mike, yet no fear or awe of him. They went right at his throat battling him. Saying what Margaret accomplished can be equaled or surpassed is a fact not an insult. Last time I checked she was a mortal being.

 

[Norcal_Fan]

Norcal,

I said he was an upgrade from Elgin and... (I won't bite my tongue on that because he is already in almost every way) And I said "if" he stays long enough he "may" become the best Carondelet coach ever. Records are made to be broken. And opinions are made to be spoken. Some say things far more ridiculous than that like.... Lebron is better than Kobe and Jordan. Even though he keeps bouncing around ( with the league's help) to team after team to build instant all star teams instead of putting the work in with one team and going through the ups and down times.

I've seen the 3 coaches in question. And based on my belief ( and my opinion) that coaching styles that are timid and less aggressive are not as good as the more aggressive type makes me give this guy an early edge. I'm a Margaret fan. I never said he was a better coach than Margaret who was a very good coach. However what Margaret did to my knowledge in her close to 30 years was win 1 state championship with Jayne Appel and company. Not to knock her, but I think if you gave any good coach close to 30 years at Carondelet they could also win a state championship or two and dominate league. Winning league games (135-2) when your team is clearly better isn't all that impressive to me. I judge things on winning 50/50 games, under dog games, and championships. And the experience during and after being positive for those you coach. So far only championships is lacking for the new guy. Sure it may take time to win a championship or two. Good luck at the Nike TOC and beyond.

And those that would want to knock the new coach and claim that he is working with Margaret's recruits (because Bamberger and company came to the team after the legacy that Margaret built, not Elgin) those same people would say Steve Kerr was a great coach after he took over after Mark Jackson helped build and drive the Warriors to the championship door step. And they never missed a beat when Luke Walton coached the team during Kerr's absence.

Best wishes for Carondelet at the Nike TOC ! Smile

The NBA and HS/College are completely different fruits...apples to oranges. Professional athletes are the best of the Best and coaching at the NBA/WNBA level is much different than coaching Catholic high school girls basketball. so your Warriors comparison is a stretch. But 13/ out of 15 Section championships (since 2003) and going to the state finals four times isn't too shabby-She really did a good job with that program.

like I said, I haven't seen the guy coach but from what I've seen in the box scores, C-Let is doing great. Just because a coach comes from a D5 school doesn't mean he/she/they can't coach. Good luck to all the teams in Phoenix!

 

[Paytc]

The NBA and HS/College are completely different fruits...apples to oranges. Professional athletes are the best of the Best and coaching at the NBA/WNBA level is much different than coaching Catholic high school girls basketball. so your Warriors comparison is a stretch. But 13/ out of 15 Section championships (since 2003) and going to the state finals four times isn't too shabby-She really did a good job with that program.

like I said, I haven't seen the guy coach but from what I've seen in the box scores, C-Let is doing great. Just because a coach comes from a D5 school doesn't mean he/she/they can't coach. Good luck to all the teams in Phoenix!

Norcal_Fan,

I have major love and respect for just about all of your comments. So I'm not mad at cha. Smile

Success is success and basketball is basketball. Sure different levels. But it's not like those coaching at different levels don't coach players also at different levels. All I said was this IMO was a coaching upgrade. And IMO the sky is the limit to what Carondelet can accomplish at this point. No coach on any level has done anything that can't be accomplished again. Or anything that can't be surpassed. Even any coach at SMS, Mitty, Pinewood, MM, Mater dei, De La Salle, or anywhere else. As much as I respect all the coaches that have or are still coaching at those programs.

Obviously the new coach will have some highs and lows like any and every other coach. And obviously he hasn't accomplished everything at Carondelet even Elgin did. It won't be easy for Carondelet to beat most likely Heritage for the third season straight in the NCS championship if they both make it that far.. It wouldn't have been easy for Elgin to beat Heritage 3 times straight either. I personally think Carondelet has a better chance to win the NCS over Heritage for the 3rd time with the coaching switch. Yet it still has to be done and won't be easy. But that doesn't mean I or anyone else can't be excited for both the team and new coaching staff. Or the Carondelet basketball program in general.

 

[Norcal_Fan]

You can use any semantics you like to sum up what I say even though it's the truth. I dam your faint of me too, so what? I own everything I say. I said in essence that Elgin was an ok coach nothing special. And that Margaret was a very good coach. I also said what she accomplished could be surpassed. Why should anyone coach or play the game if they weren't aiming to push the boundaries of accomplishment further and further? I also said Michael Jordan was a bit over rated. Did that mean I did't respect or think he was an awesome player? That too was why I loved Kobe and Allen Iverson. Because they both had major respect and love for Mike, yet no fear or awe of him. They went right at his throat battling him. Saying what Margaret accomplished can be equaled or surpassed is a fact not an insult. Last time I checked she was a mortal being.

I feel ya!
[
that being said....Saying that Michael Jordan was overrated is definitely means you didn't think he was an awesome player. When the consensus is that he is top 2-3 to every play the game, you saying he's overrated is a complete diss. haha

But you're right, it's your opinion and you're entitled to it. I agree about the previous coach and think Margaret did a great job when she was at the helm and do hope that Morris is just as successful or even more at C-Let!

 

[Paytc]

I feel ya!
[
that being said....Saying that Michael Jordan was overrated is definitely means you didn't think he was an awesome player. When the consensus is that he is top 2-3 to every play the game, you saying he's overrated is a complete diss. haha

But you're right, it's your opinion and you're entitled to it. I agree about the previous coach and think Margaret did a great job when she was at the helm and do hope that Morris is just as successful or even more at C-Let!

I guess we have to agree to dis agree on how great I thought MJ was. I thought in many ways he was the best ever. I also thought he like every other great player or great coach should be respected yet still challenged. I don't think any mortal is so beyond touch that one should always have to bow down and praise them. And when I say over rated I mean because Magic suddenly out of no where had to retire the NBA all of a sudden knew they had to fill in for the level of mass appeal and excitement the Boston vs Los Angles rivalry with Bird and Magic. So all of a sudden the league threw all they had into marketing MJ and the NBA together. Kind of the way they are doing with Lebron James and why they hand cuffed Kobe and ran him out of the league. Before Magic went down the NBA commentators often said MJ was a selfish player and he'd never win a championship. Magic goes down then all the hype was piled behind marketing MJ like no player before in NBA history. That hype made him a bit over hyped. I think over hyped might be better words to describe MJ than over rated. My bad. Thanks for helping me catch that slip of the tongue.

Oh and I forgot to acknowledge the Carondelet assistant coach. I also love his energy, the way they work together, and how positive and engaged he also is. I unfortunately don't know his name yet.

 

[mkbgdns]

I guess we cant forget that paytc will take any chance he can to make backhanded comments towards elgin.. the man has some disdain for the prior coach

Not to knock her, but I think if you gave any good coach close to 30 years at Carondelet they could also win a state championship or two

Coach Gartner won one. I think if paytc plays tennis, he has a wicked backhand.

Coach Leslie's tenure coincided with paytc's daughter's 4-year tenure on varsity (major accomplishment at a top-notch program). there might be a Dissatisfied Parent in there. but I said might.

 

[Paytc]

Coach Gartner won one. I think if paytc plays tennis, he has a wicked backhand.

Coach Leslie's tenure coincided with paytc's daughter's 4-year tenure on varsity (major accomplishment at a top-notch program). there might be a Dissatisfied Parent in there. but I said might.

mkbgdns,

Actually mixed feeling if you can believe that. I talked with Elgin off and on and offered to help any way I could. We weren't friends or enemies and still aren't. I appreciated some of what he did. Anyone close to the situation knows we were team players. And they know my daughter kept a great attitude at all times. And she enjoyed her friends, teammates, teachers, and high school experience which is all that mattered. Did Elgin and I have different philosophies, expectations, perspectives, and values....? Just slightly LOL.....

 

[mkbgdns]

All I said was this IMO was a coaching upgrade.

my apologies, the above just triggered my ptsd. maybe you can talk about this year's team without constantly referencing your opinions about last year's staff. we all really know that you think coaching's better this year. we all got it the first time. and the fifth time. and from now forward, the former staff aren't with the team, are they?

 

[Paytc]

my apologies, the above just triggered my ptsd. maybe you can talk about this year's team without constantly referencing your opinions about last year's staff. we all really know that you think coaching's better this year. we all got it the first time. and the fifth time. and from now forward, the former staff aren't with the team, are they?

mkbgdns,

Actually I never said it that much. If so I truly wasn't aware of it and I apologize. I don't get really madd at anybody. But at the same time I'm the type of guy who demands the best from myself and everybody. No doubt I have a lot of room to get better as a parent and a person.

Carondelet under the right circumstances could have broken their foot into the butts of quite a few teams the past 4 seasons. And not doing so is what never sat good with me. And it was because the expectations and fire had a flame that was set much too low IMO. I'm excited that this season under this staff the flame is constantly having more coals thrown into the fire as it should have been all along IMO. Will they still run into peaks and valleys.... yes. But at the same time, I think they will be focused on working hard to correct mistakes and continue to get better. And that vibe and fresh outlook is why I'm excited for them. Best wishes to the staff and players.

 

[mkbgdns]

And it was because the expectations and fire had a flame that was set much too low IMO.

tough, isn't it. but we all get it, the sixth time.

Clet is formidable, and they sure ain't ducking anybody. they seem equipped to make their deepest run in the Open since it started. if MM doesn't win it (they won't), I hope it's Clet.

 

[Paytc]

tough, isn't it. but we all get it, the sixth time.

Clet is formidable, and they sure ain't ducking anybody. they seem equipped to make their deepest run in the Open since it started. if MM doesn't win it (they won't), I hope it's Clet.

Unfortunately it will depend on the seed they draw early. Because most likely there won't be many if any real easy seeds that aren't hungry themselves for an Open win or two. But I agree each chance and numbers alone give them the odds of making their deepest run. I don't recall how far they went the couple years Margaret coached them in the Open. I just remember them losing to MM when Sabrina was a sophomore and Romeo a senior. Not sure what round that painful loss came in. I'm sure you know how they've done each year they've made it into the Open Division Tournament.

 

[mkbgdns]

they look equipped to fight through a tough draw. the year you mention, Salesian won as a 5 or 6 seed, 2 road wins to get to the championship, beating MM, a 7 seed who also had two road wins. consensus that there's more parity this year than usual. but March is a long ways away.

 

[Paytc]

they look equipped to fight through a tough draw. the year you mention, Salesian won as a 5 or 6 seed, 2 road wins to get to the championship, beating MM, a 7 seed who also had two road wins. consensus that there's more parity this year than usual. but March is a long ways away.

But that was't even fair as Salesian had the mighty mighty Moore sisters that season. I think Carondelet actually beat Salesian that season in the WCJ, but I could be mistaken? If so, it's just more proof it pays to be peaking in March, not December. And drawing a first round matchup with a team you have a better matchup advantage with, and avoiding the worst matchup till the championship, also helps teams make it further. Sometimes it pays to have another team bump off a team who better matches up with your team.

Salesian that year also got the better of a very talented St. Mary's of Albany or Berkeley loaded with Green and Cowling that season on a number of occasions.

 

[ankleassassin]

Norcal,

I said he was an upgrade from Elgin and... (I won't bite my tongue on that because he is already in almost every way IMO) And I said "if" he stays long enough he "may" become the best Carondelet coach ever. Records are made to be broken. And opinions are made to be spoken. Some say things far more ridiculous than that like.... Lebron is better than Kobe and Jordan. Even though he keeps bouncing around ( with the league's help) to team after team to build instant all star teams instead of putting the work in with one team and going through the ups and down times.

I've seen the 3 coaches in question. And based on my belief ( and my opinion) that coaching styles that are timid and less aggressive are not as good as the more aggressive type makes me give this guy an early edge. I'm a Margaret fan. I never said he was a better coach than Margaret who was a very good coach. However what Margaret did to my knowledge in her close to 30 years was win 1 state championship with Jayne Appel and company. Not to knock her, but I think if you gave any good coach close to 30 years at Carondelet they could also win a state championship or two and dominate league. Winning league games (135-2) when your team is clearly better isn't all that impressive to me. I judge things on winning 50/50 games, under dog games, and championships. And the experience during and after being positive for those you coach. So far only championships is lacking for the new guy. Sure it may take time to win a championship or two. Good luck at the Nike TOC and beyond.

And those that would want to knock the new coach and claim that he is working with Margaret's recruits (because Bamberger and company came to the team after the legacy that Margaret built, not Elgin) those same people would say Steve Kerr was a great coach after he took over after Mark Jackson helped build and drive the Warriors to the championship door step. And they never missed a beat when Luke Walton coached the team during Kerr's absence.

Best wishes for Carondelet at the Nike TOC ! Smile

whats worse is these new warrior fans and women who think Curry is better than Lebron, Mike, Kobe and Magic

 

[Paytc]

whats worse is these new warrior fans and women who think Curry is better than Lebron, Mike, Kobe and Magic

ankleassassin,

If they ( Dan Gilbert, Mark Cuban, David Stern) don't make the unprecedented move of vetoing a done deal CP3 to LA trade Kobe and the Lakers continue to build the team and Kobe isn't forced to try and will the team by himself ( having to play both scorer and point guard) and blow out his achilles. Not only no achilles injury but the Lakers go on to win about 5 of the next 6 championships and Lebron wins one or none and can't return to Cleveland. And Kobe is still playing today as a cause in effect action doesn't allow a whole scandalous chain of events to ever take place. You know Dan Gilbert ( the Cav's owner) needed Lebron to hurry up and win a couple in Miami so he could return to Cleveland. So he was obviously one of the main big mouthes urging the CP3 to L.A. veto. If CP3 goes to LA the warriors never sneak in under the NBA's help Lebron win championships radar. While the league was focused on handcuffing Kobe (the biggest obstacle in Lebron winning championships way) the Warriors slipped in the back door. A Kobe with CP3 meant Curry and the Warriors would have still been victims to the Lakers who they had loss to something like 18 of the last 20 games to before they slid in the back door during the hand cuff Kobe so he has no legit help to stop Lebron from winning championships era. Then it was just a matter of the Warriors gaining a champions heart. Lebron's championship heart was left in Miami in Dwayne Wade's chest. So he without Kyrie Irving's heart couldn't stop the Warriors. I will give it up to Lebron last season in the playoffs and championship against the Warriors he played with more heart than I've ever seen him play with. But once the Warriors got a taste of championship and were no longer struggling to get there they took full advantage of the window of opportunity. And they still are, good for them ! And Steph Curry is the best shooter of all the guys on that great player list you provided no doubt. But that is where it ends for him being greater or as great as Kobe, Jordan, and Magic. Had Magic not went down to HIV he shatters the assist record and wins several more championships. And at 6'9 playing PG Magic transformed the game more than Curry's 3 point shooting has effected and also changed the game. Any player is big enough to shoot a three pointer. But Magic's size at point guard has made it much harder for guards under 6'2 to make it onto an NBA roster ever since. And since MJ and Kobe played both offense and defense at a championship level, and had two of the biggest hearts ever, I don't think Curry, Lebron, KD, or any of these new era jump to form an instant all star team era players come anywhere close to those two IMO.

 

[ankleassassin]

ankleassassin,

If they ( Dan Gilbert, Mark Cuban, David Stern) don't make the unprecedented move of vetoing a done deal CP3 to LA trade Kobe and the Lakers continue to build the team and Kobe isn't forced to try and will the team by himself ( having to play both scorer and point guard) and blow out his achilles. Not only no achilles injury but the Lakers go on to win about 5 of the next 6 championships and Lebron wins one or none and can't return to Cleveland. And Kobe is still playing today as a cause in effect action doesn't allow a whole scandalous chain of events to ever take place. You know Dan Gilbert ( the Cav's owner) needed Lebron to hurry up and win a couple in Miami so he could return to Cleveland. So he was obviously one of the main big mouthes urging the CP3 to L.A. veto. If CP3 goes to LA the warriors never sneak in under the NBA's help Lebron win championships radar. While the league was focused on handcuffing Kobe (the biggest obstacle in Lebron winning championships way) the Warriors slipped in the back door. A Kobe with CP3 meant Curry and the Warriors would have still been victims to the Lakers who they had loss to something like 18 of the last 20 games to before they slid in the back door during the hand cuff Kobe so he has no legit help to stop Lebron from winning championships era. Then it was just a matter of the Warriors gaining a champions heart. Lebron's championship heart was left in Miami in Dwayne Wade's chest. So he without Kyrie Irving's heart couldn't stop the Warriors. I will give it up to Lebron last season in the playoffs and championship against the Warriors he played with more heart than I've ever seen him play with. But once the Warriors got a taste of championship and were no longer struggling to get there they took full advantage of the window of opportunity. And they still are, good for them ! And Steph Curry is the best shooter of all the guys on that great player list you provided no doubt. But that is where it ends for him being greater or as great as Kobe, Jordan, and Magic. Had Magic not went down to HIV he shatters the assist record and wins several more championships. And at 6'9 playing PG Magic transformed the game more than Curry's 3 point shooting has effected and also changed the game. Any player is big enough to shoot a three pointer. But Magic's size at point guard has made it much harder for guards under 6'2 to make it onto an NBA roster ever since. And since MJ and Kobe played both offense and defense at a championship level, and had two of the biggest hearts ever, I don't think Curry, Lebron, KD, or any of these new era jump to form an instant all star team era players come anywhere close to those two IMO.

as a laker fan i hate everything about the warriors and the bandwagon...
i also am a lebron fan so i welcome him.

 

[Paytc]

as a laker fan i hate everything about the warriors and the bandwagon...
i also am a lebron fan so i welcome him.

I was a Laker fan before the NBA pulled the CP3 veto. If Lebron and everyone else can get help why wasn't Kobe allowed to have help? Seemed a bit rigged. Now the way it's about players calling one another to form all star teams with no player or team loyalty, and owners using their money and influence to make or break deals that are already done is shady business IMO. I just either don't watch much or just support local teams every now and again. I like Lebron but I don't like the way he can push off on every drive to the basket and gets away with it. He's too big to also not be allowed to guard without calling fouls on him when he makes obvious fouls. The game like so many sports have become big business. And too many leagues go too far to make products and some players more marketable and the game less credible IMO. Like Pac once said " ain't nothing like the ole school." Since Lebron is the league's poster child, your Lakers will most likely get major help at the trade deadline. Probably Anthony Davis, Kawhi Leonard, Westbrook, or some top tier player even if they have to pull another unprecedented move like the CP3 done deal veto. They may all be under contract but who knows what can and will happen these days? We're living in a time where integrity and credibility no longer have value. Lakers are turning the corner and they will get that league assist with Lebron they wouldn't give Kobe. The league never saw the warriors coming. And they can't be too happy their poster child hasn't been able to get past the Warriors.

 

[SouthBayHoopFan]

Probably a good time to move your latest conversation to reddit.