CCS Open - Second Game Results

[TheHillZ]

Mitty 78 Branham 24. It wasn't quite that close. Perhaps for the first time in her Mitty career, McKenna Woliczko matched up with a girl that was considerably taller than she in Branham's Quinn Godfrey. It was no contest. Woliczko scored from everywhere en route to an 18 point first half. Morgan Cheli is in midseason form with dazzling buckets and assists.

Crystal Springs 39 Los Gatos 25. Lots of defense from Crystal, not a lot of offense from Los Gatos who was still missing its top scorer. Crystal pitched a shutout in the 4th quarter. Nice bounce back for the Gryphons in what has to be their first ever open win. Crystal Jr. Maile Bateman led a balanced attack with 12.

Pinewood 54 Palo Alto 46. Four Panthers in double figures led by Ava Uhrich's 15 helped them overcome a four point Paly halftime lead. Kayla Peters led the Vikes with 16. Pinewood is through to the finals with a win against SHCP. But they're out with a loss. If I'm doing my math right, Paly can still advance to the finals with a win against SI, if Pinewood loses. First prize is a matchup with Mitty. Second prize may be a lower division in Norcal. Hmmmm.

SHCP 66 SI 52. They say it's tough to beat the same team three times in a season, and it was tougher for Sacred Heart tonight. Only a two point game at the end of the third, before they pulled away for the victory. Reza Po had at least 30. But they need a win against Pinewood and a Palo Alto loss to advance out of their pool.

 

[iamgearyblvd]

Can someone please explain the formula if there are (3) 2-1 teams at the end of pool play, who advances? Is it a point differential criteria?

 

[becoolpt55]

Might be time to tank a game and win a State Championship in a lower( less than Open) division

 

[TheHillZ]

Can someone please explain the formula if there are (3) 2-1 teams at the end of pool play, who advances? Is it a point differential criteria?

The formula favors the lower seeds in that scenario. It asks which 2-1 team beat the best teams. To do that, it adds up the seed numbers of the two teams that were beaten and whoever has the lowest combined total -- that is, whoever beat the best seeded teams -- wins the tie breaker.

SHC is the #2 Seed. If it beats Pinewood (#3 seed), it will be 2-1. It will have wins over #3 and St. Ignatius #6 seed. It's total is nine.

Pinewood is the #3 seed. If it loses to SHC (#2 seed), it will be 2-1. It will have wins over #6 SI and and #7 Palo Alto. It's total is thirteen.

Palo Alto is the #7 seed. If it beats SI (#6 seed), it will be 2-1. It will have wins over #2 SHC and #6 SI. It's total is eight.

With the lowest total of eight, Palo Alto would advance under the tie breaker rules.

P.S. Where there are only two teams tied at 2-1, the tiebreaker is just who won head to head. So if SHC beats Pinewood and Paly loses to SI, SHC would advance. In other words, Pinewood can only advance with a win.

 

[blex20]

Might be time to tank a game and win a State Championship in a lower( less than Open) division

Might just be me, but I believe that only the Open winner gets put in NorCal Open. I assume runner up is a high D1 seed. Expect to see Mitty, SJS D1 Winner, NCS Open Winner, Oakland Tech, Piedmont in Open. Then you still have NCS Open runner-up and/or SJS D1 runner-up. I suppose you could put runner for CCS, NCS and SJS all in but I think they roll with 6, which means D1 Bracket will still be ultra competitive with any combination of Carondelet, Salesian, SRV, CN, Pinewood, SHC, SMS/Folsom, etc.

That being said, SHC had every chance to "tank" a game last night against SI (tied even late into the 3rd) but they still pulled it out. Still without their starting forward, who is out with a broken finger. That's a big loss for a team that spent most of the season on just a 7 player rotation.

 

[blex20]

The formula favors the lower seeds in that scenario. It asks which 2-1 team beat the best teams. To do that, it adds up the seed numbers of the two teams that were beaten and whoever has the lowest combined total -- that is, whoever beat the best seeded teams -- wins the tie breaker.

SHC is the #2 Seed. If it beats Pinewood (#3 seed), it will be 2-1. It will have wins over #3 and St. Ignatius #6 seed. It's total is nine.

Pinewood is the #3 seed. If it loses to SHC (#2 seed), it will be 2-1. It will have wins over #6 SI and and #7 Palo Alto. It's total is thirteen.

Palo Alto is the #7 seed. If it beats SI (#6 seed), it will be 2-1. It will have wins over #2 SHC and #6 SI. It's total is eight.

With the lowest total of eight, Palo Alto would advance under the tie breaker rules.

P.S. Where there are only two teams tied at 2-1, the tiebreaker is just who won head to head. So if SHC beats Pinewood and Paly loses to SI, SHC would advance. In other words, Pinewood can only advance with a win.

This is some great knowledge! Thanks for breaking it down.

 

[EHS HOOPS]

Might just be me, but I believe that only the Open winner gets put in NorCal Open. I assume runner up is a high D1 seed. Expect to see Mitty, SJS D1 Winner, NCS Open Winner, Oakland Tech, Piedmont in Open. Then you still have NCS Open runner-up and/or SJS D1 runner-up. I suppose you could put runner for CCS, NCS and SJS all in but I think they roll with 6, which means D1 Bracket will still be ultra competitive with any combination of Carondelet, Salesian, SRV, CN, Pinewood, SHC, SMS/Folsom, etc.

That being said, SHC had every chance to "tank" a game last night against SI (tied even late into the 3rd) but they still pulled it out. Still without their starting forward, who is out with a broken finger. That's a big loss for a team that spent most of the season on just a 7 player rotation.

Do the other Open teams in CCS advance to lower divisions as well? Palo Alto, SI, Los Gatos, Branham, and Crystal?

 

[blex20]

Do the other Open teams in CCS advance to lower divisions as well? Palo Alto, SI, Los Gatos, Branham, and Crystal?

All open teams have an auto bid into NorCal. The question is which division will each be placed?

 

[northbaybbguru]

Barring any major upsets these 6 are in (NorCal Open)....

Mitty
Piedmont
Folsom
SMS
Oakland Tech
NCS Open winner

The only question is how many does the CIF go with? 6? 7? 8?
If more than 6 then we start getting into does CW come north and runnerups in NCS and CCS.

 

[LBJ6]

Do the other Open teams in CCS advance to lower divisions as well? Palo Alto, SI, Los Gatos, Branham, and Crystal?

likley the 2 through 6 seeds in CCS Open will be D1. 7 and 8 seed or 2nd to last place and last place will be fringe D1 to D2. Last year 5 CCS teams were in the State D1 bracket. Saint Francis ( was a 5 seed in CCS/got 8 seed in D1), Valley Christian ( Was a 4 seed in CCS open/ got 5th seed in in D1), Sacred Heart Cath ( was a 6 seed in CCS open and a 13 seed in D1), Saint Ignatius ( was a 2 seed in CCS open and a 3 seed in D1 Norcal), Palo Alto ( was a 7 seed in CCS open and a 10 seed in D1 Norcal). So most likley Mitty goes Open, the 2 through 7 seeds are in D1 and the 8 seed may get bumped to a top D2 seed. D1 Bracket last year had 8 NCS teams, 5 CCS and 3 SJS. Would guess something similar this year.

 

[northbaybbguru]

likley the 2 through 6 seeds in CCS Open will be D1. 7 and 8 seed or 2nd to last place and last place will be fringe D1 to D2. Last year 5 CCS teams were in the State D1 bracket. Saint Francis ( was a 5 seed in CCS/got 8 seed in D1), Valley Christian ( Was a 4 seed in CCS open/ got 5th seed in in D1), Sacred Heart Cath ( was a 6 seed in CCS open and a 13 seed in D1), Saint Ignatius ( was a 2 seed in CCS open and a 3 seed in D1 Norcal), Palo Alto ( was a 7 seed in CCS open and a 10 seed in D1 Norcal). So most likley Mitty goes Open, the 2 through 7 seeds are in D1 and the 8 seed may get bumped to a top D2 seed. D1 Bracket last year had 8 NCS teams, 5 CCS and 3 SJS. Would guess something similar this year.

I agree with your points. In fact you can almost pencil in your 16 D1 teams already.

Assuming 6 in North Open...and no major upsets...

3 SJS: Antelope, McClatchy, Vanden
5 CCS: 2-6 CCS Open
8 NCS: 2-6 NCS Open NCS D1 winner, D2 winner, D3 winner.

Theres your 16...

 

[iamgearyblvd]

Might just be me, but I believe that only the Open winner gets put in NorCal Open. I assume runner up is a high D1 seed. Expect to see Mitty, SJS D1 Winner, NCS Open Winner, Oakland Tech, Piedmont in Open. Then you still have NCS Open runner-up and/or SJS D1 runner-up. I suppose you could put runner for CCS, NCS and SJS all in but I think they roll with 6, which means D1 Bracket will still be ultra competitive with any combination of Carondelet, Salesian, SRV, CN, Pinewood, SHC, SMS/Folsom, etc.

That being said, SHC had every chance to "tank" a game last night against SI (tied even late into the 3rd) but they still pulled it out. Still without their starting forward, who is out with a broken finger. That's a big loss for a team that spent most of the season on just a 7 player rotation.

Is Inez out out (season over) or can she come back for NorCals? Her length and versatility are vital. Irish shouldnt keep on relying on Reza to bail them out with 29 pt efforts.

 

[blex20]

Is Inez out out (season over) or can she come back for NorCals? Her length and versatility are vital. Irish shouldnt keep on relying on Reza to bail them out with 29 pt efforts.

The hope is she will return vs Pinewood. It might be a matter of pain management, if she gets doctor's clearance. Reza had a career game last night for sure. But 33 points is not the norm. She's a high teen average with Gallegos and Blecha in mid-teens. That is usually good for about 45-50 points each game so missing Gallegos is huge both offensively and defensively/rebounding. She would be the likely candidate to match up with Ava on Wednesday, otherwise you'll have some smaller players trying to contain her, which would favor Pinewood.

 

[WBBallFan]

So looking at Pool A, Los Gatos has been out with a couple of girls (Volleyball and Covid), and will go 0-3 as they face Mitty tomorrow. Tomorrow between Crystal and Branham.... correct me if I'm wrong... winner gets the pleasure of traveling and a low seed in D1 and loser gets high D2 seed? Thoughts?

 

[LBJ6]

So looking at Pool A, Los Gatos has been out with a couple of girls (Volleyball and Covid), and will go 0-3 as they face Mitty tomorrow. Tomorrow between Crystal and Branham.... correct me if I'm wrong... winner gets the pleasure of traveling and a low seed in D1 and loser gets high D2 seed? Thoughts?

Pretty much loser will get a top seed in D2. Let the tank games begin

 

[ClayK]

Past history suggests:

1) Number of boys teams in Open brackets equals number of girls teams;
2) Number of teams in SoCal Open brackets equals number of teams in NorCal Open brackets.

The boys will drive the final decision, I think, and I have no idea about that side of the equation.

Note, however, that there is somewhat of a desire to limit the size of the Open brackets so that only teams that have a chance to win them are placed there. Running-clock blowouts -- such as Sage Hill vs. Sierra Canyon -- are embarrassing. And you can bet Sage Hill will do everything it can to stay out of the SoCal Open (along with a lot of other teams, like Clovis West and Westchester and Westview).

Should be a very interesting meeting ..

 

[TheHillZ]

Pretty much loser will get a top seed in D2. Let the tank games begin

Will go out on a limb and say there's no way either Branham or Crystal gives less than 100%. CCS Open is unchartered territory for both. I'd be surprised if either team is even thinking past the next game.

 

[LBJ6]

Will go out on a limb and say there's no way either Branham or Crystal gives less than 100%. CCS Open is unchartered territory for both. I'd be surprised if either team is even thinking past the next game.

How it should be! Great for both teams.

 

[WBBallFan]

Pretty much loser will get a top seed in D2. Let the tank games begin

Any chance of Crystal losing tomorrow, going 1-2 overall, and getting

Will go out on a limb and say there's no way either Branham or Crystal gives less than 100%. CCS Open is unchartered territory for both. I'd be surprised if either team is even thinking past the next game.

If last year is any indication, top two teams went open, HMB went back to D4, but other five teams went D1. Regardless of finish today, Branham/Crystal may go D1… perhaps they are just playing for a higher D1 seed today.

 

[TheHillZ]

I don't know the Northern Section teams at all. And I don't know whether the Central Section teams (several of whom are excellent) will come up. But I would be surprised if either Branham or Crystal is in D1 for Norcal, regardless of the outcome of tonight's game. That's not to take anything away from either team. They've earned their spots in CCS. But the other Bay Area sections are considerably stronger than CCS this year.

If CIF is truly shooting for competitiveness, I think Mitty is the only Norcal Open team from CCS. SHC, Pinewood and Paly, if it wins tonight, are D1. Branham/Crystal winner is D2. Loser is D3 along with SI and Los Gatos.

 

[Norcal_Fan]

Past history suggests:

1) Number of boys teams in Open brackets equals number of girls teams;
2) Number of teams in SoCal Open brackets equals number of teams in NorCal Open brackets.

The boys will drive the final decision, I think, and I have no idea about that side of the equation.

Note, however, that there is somewhat of a desire to limit the size of the Open brackets so that only teams that have a chance to win them are placed there. Running-clock blowouts -- such as Sage Hill vs. Sierra Canyon -- are embarrassing. And you can bet Sage Hill will do everything it can to stay out of the SoCal Open (along with a lot of other teams, like Clovis West and Westchester and Westview).

Should be a very interesting meeting ..

Clay,

who do you think gets the #1 seed? Mitty of Piedmont, when Piedmont has the head to head win?

 

[ClayK]

Here's one thing about rankings and seedings: Justification is important.

When you have a potentially controversial decision to make, you have to justify it after the fact to those who disagree.

So if I pick Piedmont No. 1, my justification is simple: Piedmont beat Mitty head to head. How can you seed a team below a team it beat?

So if I pick Mitty No. 1, my justification is a little more convoluted. Yes, Mitty lost that game, but they had just lost Morgan Cheli to injury, and since then they have played a much tougher schedule and beaten much tougher teams. Piedmont might have been better then, but Mitty has Cheli back and is better now.

The simplicity of picking Piedmont is obvious, and also consider this phrase from women's basketball writer Joe Smith (RIP): Result nullification. If you choose Mitty, you're arbitrarily, to some extent, nullifying the most important result.

So you're a committee member. Which way do you vote?

 

[northbaybbguru]

Here's one thing about rankings and seedings: Justification is important.

When you have a potentially controversial decision to make, you have to justify it after the fact to those who disagree.

So if I pick Piedmont No. 1, my justification is simple: Piedmont beat Mitty head to head. How can you seed a team below a team it beat?

So if I pick Mitty No. 1, my justification is a little more convoluted. Yes, Mitty lost that game, but they had just lost Morgan Cheli to injury, and since then they have played a much tougher schedule and beaten much tougher teams. Piedmont might have been better then, but Mitty has Cheli back and is better now.

The simplicity of picking Piedmont is obvious, and also consider this phrase from women's basketball writer Joe Smith (RIP): Result nullification. If you choose Mitty, you're arbitrarily, to some extent, nullifying the most important result.

So you're a committee member. Which way do you vote?

Piedmont #1 .... period

Undefeated AND h2h... no question

 

[bayareagbballfan]

Isn't there a CIF guideline? I think it says head to head and then common opponent. Doesn't say anything about 'if a team's best player is hurt' I think Piedmont is #1

 

[TightWadHill]

The game in question was also played on Piedmont's home court. What is the equivalent of football's 3-point home field advantage? Piedmont won 60-56 by four points. The injury to Cheli happened in the 1st half of the previous game vs Vanden. HC Sue Phillips didn't really have the time to figure out role changes for her players, etc. She did that in the four games at the Nike TOC in Phoenix.

I think that you "pro NCS guys" will be shocked in a rematch. I will be shocked if Mitty doesn't win easily. GO CCS!

 

[blex20]

I guess the big advantage/difference between the 1 or 2 seed is who you could potentially face in the semi's. As a 2, you would essentially face the "3rd best team" but as the 1, it would likely be the "4th best team." In either case, I assume you would still hold home court for that particular game and the championship game would presumably be played at a neutral site. These two teams are so good, I don't know that it really matters which seed they are going into NorCals, as I would expect them to be facing off on that neutral site regardless.

 

[northbaybbguru]

The game in question was also played on Piedmont's home court. What is the equivalent of football's 3-point home field advantage? Piedmont won 60-56 by four points. The injury to Cheli happened in the 1st half of the previous game vs Vanden. HC Sue Phillips didn't really have the time to figure out role changes for her players, etc. She did that in the four games at the Nike TOC in Phoenix.

I think that you "pro NCS guys" will be shocked in a rematch. I will be shocked if Mitty doesn't win easily. GO CCS!

We are talking seedings...not rematch predictions. Im pretty sure us "pro NCS guys" wouldnt be shocked.

 

[northbaybbguru]

The game in question was also played on Piedmont's home court. What is the equivalent of football's 3-point home field advantage? Piedmont won 60-56 by four points. The injury to Cheli happened in the 1st half of the previous game vs Vanden. HC Sue Phillips didn't really have the time to figure out role changes for her players, etc. She did that in the four games at the Nike TOC in Phoenix.

I think that you "pro NCS guys" will be shocked in a rematch. I will be shocked if Mitty doesn't win easily. GO CCS!

I'd have to give it to Mitty though because apparently their program is so good that even a h2h loss doesnt deter their people from claiming the #1 seed is rightfully theirs.

But then again they did lose to Pinewood in the Norcal finals 1 year and were still rewarded with a "National Championship" despite not even making the Calif STATE championship game so I'm guessing the entitlement over there runs pretty deep. 🤷

 

[NCallie1]

I guess the big advantage/difference between the 1 or 2 seed is who you could potentially face in the semi's. As a 2, you would essentially face the "3rd best team" but as the 1, it would likely be the "4th best team." In either case, I assume you would still hold home court for that particular game and the championship game would presumably be played at a neutral site. These two teams are so good, I don't know that it really matters which seed they are going into NorCals, as I would expect them to be facing off on that neutral site regardless.

How about CW? Where do they fit in this equation? A friend of mine from Fresno tells me they believe they are the #1 based on highest national ranking of the 3 teams and a very tough overall schedule.

 

[northbaybbguru]

How about CW? Where do they fit in this equation? A friend of mine from Fresno tells me they believe they are the #1 based on highest national ranking of the 3 teams and a very tough overall

I know I've stated on a prior post how I thought CW would come North but as the South plays out and with all the lopsided scores I'm starting to come over to the side that they will stay in the South. Otherwise the CIF is going to have a heck of a time filling out the bracket.

I'm predicting a 6 team bracket:

SOUTH

Sierra Canyon
LCD
Etiwanda
CW
Mater Dei
???


NORTH

Piedmont
Mitty
Folsom
SMS
Oakland Tech
NCS winner

 

[Norcal_Fan]

Here's one thing about rankings and seedings: Justification is important.

When you have a potentially controversial decision to make, you have to justify it after the fact to those who disagree.

So if I pick Piedmont No. 1, my justification is simple: Piedmont beat Mitty head to head. How can you seed a team below a team it beat?

So if I pick Mitty No. 1, my justification is a little more convoluted. Yes, Mitty lost that game, but they had just lost Morgan Cheli to injury, and since then they have played a much tougher schedule and beaten much tougher teams. Piedmont might have been better then, but Mitty has Cheli back and is better now.

The simplicity of picking Piedmont is obvious, and also consider this phrase from women's basketball writer Joe Smith (RIP): Result nullification. If you choose Mitty, you're arbitrarily, to some extent, nullifying the most important result.

So you're a committee member. Which way do you vote?

I'd probably pick Piedmont because of the head to head. They're (committee) isn't supposed to take into account sick, ill, injured players. just look at the numbers, which to some extent is horrible. But I won't be surprised if Mitty is #1

 

[HoopDreamz415]

I agree, Piedmont should be the #1 seed. Cheli or not Piedmont earned it. Same team without Cheli went to TOC and held their own, can't use it as a crutch now. Piedmont has the H2H and better overall record. However, I'm not on the committee. If we look by the CIF Seeding criteria:

Criteria Considered for Divisional Placement and Hosting of Regional Games (not listed in any particular order)
a. Win-Loss Record (Preseason, League, Section Playoffs)
b. Strength of Schedule (Preseason, League, Section Playoffs)
c. Head to Head Competition
d. Common Opponents
e. Opponents Win-Loss Record
f. Various rankings may be consulted when placing teams (i.e. MaxPreps, ScoreBookLive, etc.)
g. Suitability to represent the State Championship with regards to Pursuing Victory with Honor and acceptable standards of sportsmanship.

If they just go by who checks more boxes its Mitty. Hopefully they have some sort of hierarchy when it comes to the list. Not sure how H2H competition wouldn't hold more weight, if so.

 

[ClayK]

So the strength of schedule is tricky because a team can't be punished because its mandated league games are against weak opponents. So the raw numbers of strength of schedule can't totally apply to Mitty and Piedmont.

Another issue is factoring in out-of-state competition. Mitty's win over Sacred Heart of Kentucky is huge, and the loss to Long Island Lutheran is to a very good team. NorCal wins for Mitty: Cardinal Newman, BOD, SMS, Vanden, Oakland Tech, SHC.

Piedmont beat Salesian, BOD, Cardinal Newman, Oakland Tech and Acalanes.

Final possible factor: Piedmont left two games on the table and conceivably could have added a couple tough opponents.

If the two out-of-state games cancel each other out, the schedule difference comes down to Vanden and SHC vs. Acalanes. Is that enough to trump head-to-head?

 

[Streak One]

I know I've stated on a prior post how I thought CW would come North but as the South plays out and with all the lopsided scores I'm starting to come over to the side that they will stay in the South. Otherwise the CIF is going to have a heck of a time filling out the bracket.

I'm predicting a 6 team bracket:

SOUTH

Sierra Canyon
LCD
Etiwanda
CW
Mater Dei
???


NORTH

Piedmont
Mitty
Folsom
SMS
Oakland Tech
NCS winner

This looks right to me too. Seems like the girls side has a really solid six teams for Open this year

 

[HoopDreamz415]

So the strength of schedule is tricky because a team can't be punished because its mandated league games are against weak opponents. So the raw numbers of strength of schedule can't totally apply to Mitty and Piedmont.

Another issue is factoring in out-of-state competition. Mitty's win over Sacred Heart of Kentucky is huge, and the loss to Long Island Lutheran is to a very good team. NorCal wins for Mitty: Cardinal Newman, BOD, SMS, Vanden, Oakland Tech, SHC.

Piedmont beat Salesian, BOD, Cardinal Newman, Oakland Tech and Acalanes.

Final possible factor: Piedmont left two games on the table and conceivably could have added a couple tough opponents.

If the two out-of-state games cancel each other out, the schedule difference comes down to Vanden and SHC vs. Acalanes. Is that enough to trump head-to-head?

I don't think anything trumps H2H when the team with the H2H win has the better record. Those two categories sit up top on the criteria list, IMO. Here's how I had the boxes checked:

Piedmont - Win/Loss record and H2H

Mitty - SOS, *Common Opp (if point diff/margin is used), Opp Win/Loss Record and Various Rankings.

Both - Suitability to represent the State Championship.

I think most agree on Piedmont #1. I just don't know if there is a ranking to the criteria list or is it who checks more boxes. The committee/CIF should specify on the website.

*Branson vs Piedmont pending

 

[NCallie1]

I know I've stated on a prior post how I thought CW would come North but as the South plays out and with all the lopsided scores I'm starting to come over to the side that they will stay in the South. Otherwise the CIF is going to have a heck of a time filling out the bracket.

I'm predicting a 6 team bracket:

SOUTH

Sierra Canyon
LCD
Etiwanda
CW
Mater Dei
???


NORTH

Piedmont
Mitty
Folsom
SMS
Oakland Tech
NCS winner

Very reasonable.

 

[HoopDreamz415]

If CW boys win the D1 Central Section and get sent to the Norcal Open. Would that have any affect on CW girls getting sent up here?

 

[bayareagbballfan]

I don't think anything trumps H2H when the team with the H2H win has the better record. Those two categories sit up top on the criteria list, IMO. Here's how I had the boxes checked:

Piedmont - Win/Loss record and H2H

Mitty - SOS, *Common Opp (if point diff/margin is used), Opp Win/Loss Record and Various Rankings.

Both - Suitability to represent the State Championship.

I think most agree on Piedmont #1. I just don't know if there is a ranking to the criteria list or is it who checks more boxes. The committee/CIF should specify on the website.

*Branson vs Piedmont pending

I don't think you can look at win/loss record without SoS together. They shouldn't be separate criteria. Great SoS mean nothing if you lost against all the good teams, and a perfect season means nothing if you never played anyone good. Mitty has the better SoS + win/loss record due to ToC. Their loss to LuHi doesn't make them worse than Piedmont. Piedmont would have lost to LuHi. If H2H is the top or only criteria, Piedmont is #1 obviously. If other factors can be considered, then Mitty is #1 because remember, the top bracket in ToC is the same or better than the NorCal and SoCal Opens. LCD lost to LuHi by 13 in ToC.

 

[HoopDreamz415]

I don't think you can look at win/loss record without SoS together. They shouldn't be separate criteria. Great SoS mean nothing if you lost against all the good teams, and a perfect season means nothing if you never played anyone good. Mitty has the better SoS + win/loss record due to ToC. Their loss to LuHi doesn't make them worse than Piedmont. Piedmont would have lost to LuHi. If H2H is the top or only criteria, Piedmont is #1 obviously. If other factors can be considered, then Mitty is #1 because remember, the top bracket in ToC is the same or better than the NorCal and SoCal Opens. LCD lost to LuHi by 13 in ToC.

I have Mitty with the better SOS (written in the post), so no argument there. I never mentioned the loss to LuHi, I think you're talking to ClayK. You're preaching to the choir on SOS.

However, CIF lists them as separate criterias. Doesn't say SOS + win/loss. We wouldn't all be having these conversations if we knew the exact weight or formula. Obviously, an undefeated Mickey Mouse schedule would hurt a teams seeding. But H2H is the top criteria to me in this case. Piedmont has the better record AND Piedmont's SOS isn't so weak that it takes away from their perfect record.

There have been years Zags (MBB) SOS was weak but somehow earned high/top seeds. Understanding committees on any level is a head scratcher.

Again, Mitty checks more boxes on the criteria list but I'm giving Piedmont the #1 seed. Wouldn't be surprised either way the committee goes. Hopefully, we get a round 2 regardless of seeding.

 

[cabasketballjournal]

Piedmont did not beat TECH.
They did not play