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Menlo-Atherton at Eureka - NorCal 3AA Matchup

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Thought I would start a tread for this match-up and hope it does not turn into "CN deserves to be here" post.

11-2 (39.6) Menlo-Atherton at 12-0 (39.9) Eureka

It's actually a pretty good match-up. But I think the Bears are more battle tested and will prevail in this one. But really don't know much about either programs.

So, who wins? Like to here everyone's thoughts.
 
I think it will be M/A in a cakewalk. Assuming they don’t shoot them selves in the foot as they sometimes do. The question is is who starts at QB for M/A?
 
As a Eureka native, I'm concerned about M-A's talent level. There's no mistaking the fact that one team has a bunch of legit, high-level D-I talents. And M-A just won a section title over an excellent team in a tough section/division.

That said, Eureka High teams that get deep into the playoffs like this are really good, tough teams. It's a small town public high school, so there are ebbs and flows with the talent level and, in turn, results. But when a good group comes through it's a group that has been playing together their whole lives. This group of seniors has gone 23-1 as upperclassmen and has improved a lot since the start of last season. The lone loss was on a last-second FG at Rancho Cotate (which has been excellent) in last year's playoffs after EHS was a whisker away from just running out the clock with a time-consuming drive (before some officiating high jinks popped up and extended a helping hand to the home team).

It's always interesting to see how coaches react to making the trek north into Humboldt or Del Norte County for a playoff game. It's incredible how often there will be postgame quotes from a losing Bay Area coach about A) the travel (as if all the H-DN teams don't have to travel the same distance down all the time) and/or B) the weather/playing conditions. Sure enough, I read a couple quotes in an East Bay Times article published Sunday that fit this mold: Las Lomas' coach called Eureka High's Albee Stadium "unplayable" and M-A's coach accused Eureka High of being untruthful about the field conditions.

News flash, guys: they still play football games on grass and football games aren't canceled due to rain/mud. Albee Stadium was very wet between the hashes last weekend, but that tends to happen when a storm rolls through. The field is also in a small ravine. Both teams had to deal with the conditions. In fact, it was Eureka that lost FIVE fumble before halftime (two deep in LL territory when about to score and two deep in its own territory without allowing points). LL couldn't score and Eureka still managed a 21-0 win (that easily could've been of the 35+ to 0 variety) over a team that had been dominant all season.

This game has since been moved to McKinleyville High (an additional 20 minutes north of EHS), which is on a bluff over the ocean. It's a flat piece of land, so it should be less wet/muddy, but it'll still be plenty wet if there's more rain this week, and it's grass. It also gets extremely foggy there at times. I've been to games at Mack that were legitimately like the infamous Fog Bowl game.

Anyway, it's always interesting to think about how the team traveling up there will react. Will they make excuses in advance? Will they wilt because they're not playing on dry, pristine artificial turf? Will they look at this as a challenge and use it as further motivation? I know M-A is pissed about having to travel while Wilcox is playing a home game.

I think it'll be a good game and, assuming it can avoid losing a bunch of turnovers again, the inclement weather should help Eureka. And it has rolled everyone this season, including all the playoff teams it has faced. I'm rally excited to see what happens, but I'm not sure what result would surprise me. I'd probably be most surprised by a lopsided M-A win even though it has a ton of talent. History has shown that Bay Area teams don't handle travel and the wet grass fields of H-DN country well. I mean, their coaches tell us as much after these types of games.
 
As a Eureka native, I'm concerned about M-A's talent level. There's no mistaking the fact that one team has a bunch of legit, high-level D-I talents. And M-A just won a section title over an excellent team in a tough section/division.

That said, Eureka High teams that get deep into the playoffs like this are really good, tough teams. It's a small town public high school, so there are ebbs and flows with the talent level and, in turn, results. But when a good group comes through it's a group that has been playing together their whole lives. This group of seniors has gone 23-1 as upperclassmen and has improved a lot since the start of last season. The lone loss was on a last-second FG at Rancho Cotate (which has been excellent) in last year's playoffs after EHS was a whisker away from just running out the clock with a time-consuming drive (before some officiating high jinks popped up and extended a helping hand to the home team).

It's always interesting to see how coaches react to making the trek north into Humboldt or Del Norte County for a playoff game. It's incredible how often there will be postgame quotes from a losing Bay Area coach about A) the travel (as if all the H-DN teams don't have to travel the same distance down all the time) and/or B) the weather/playing conditions. Sure enough, I read a couple quotes in an East Bay Times article published Sunday that fit this mold: Las Lomas' coach called Eureka High's Albee Stadium "unplayable" and M-A's coach accused Eureka High of being untruthful about the field conditions.

News flash, guys: they still play football games on grass and football games aren't canceled due to rain/mud. Albee Stadium was very wet between the hashes last weekend, but that tends to happen when a storm rolls through. The field is also in a small ravine. Both teams had to deal with the conditions. In fact, it was Eureka that lost FIVE fumble before halftime (two deep in LL territory when about to score and two deep in its own territory without allowing points). LL couldn't score and Eureka still managed a 21-0 win (that easily could've been of the 35+ to 0 variety) over a team that had been dominant all season.

This game has since been moved to McKinleyville High (an additional 20 minutes north of EHS), which is on a bluff over the ocean. It's a flat piece of land, so it should be less wet/muddy, but it'll still be plenty wet if there's more rain this week, and it's grass. It also gets extremely foggy there at times. I've been to games at Mack that were legitimately like the infamous Fog Bowl game.

Anyway, it's always interesting to think about how the team traveling up there will react. Will they make excuses in advance? Will they wilt because they're not playing on dry, pristine artificial turf? Will they look at this as a challenge and use it as further motivation? I know M-A is pissed about having to travel while Wilcox is playing a home game.

I think it'll be a good game and, assuming it can avoid losing a bunch of turnovers again, the inclement weather should help Eureka. And it has rolled everyone this season, including all the playoff teams it has faced. I'm rally excited to see what happens, but I'm not sure what result would surprise me. I'd probably be most surprised by a lopsided M-A win even though it has a ton of talent. History has shown that Bay Area teams don't handle travel and the wet grass fields of H-DN country well. I mean, their coaches tell us as much after these types of games.

When Folsom traveled 6 hours south to Carson in 2010, where their opponent J Serra could WALK to the stadium, we heard "THEY are used to playing in the rain on sloppy grass fields!"

133627_480315807251_3684891_o.jpg

As long as you are all playing on the same field, the rest is just excuses. Good luck to the Loggers!!
 
It's funny you mention that game because while thinking about Eureka vs. M-A those 2010 games popped into my mind. I remember relishing Escalon kicking Madison's butt up and down the field when conditions were especially wet.

Sometimes it rains and fields get muddy, even if it's an NFL field. I find it almost incredible when people complain about a muddy football field. I understand that field turf football fields are de rigueur throughout the Bay Area, but I guess I underestimate how quickly people can become accustomed to always playing on field turf.

This isn't basketball or baseball, sometimes you have to play in terrible conditions. And if a team can only win when things are going just right and in optimal conditions for success, then maybe they aren't so great. Sometimes you have to "overcome" an obstacle such as a muddy field.
 
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As a Eureka native, I'm concerned about M-A's talent level. There's no mistaking the fact that one team has a bunch of legit, high-level D-I talents. And M-A just won a section title over an excellent team in a tough section/division.

That said, Eureka High teams that get deep into the playoffs like this are really good, tough teams. It's a small town public high school, so there are ebbs and flows with the talent level and, in turn, results. But when a good group comes through it's a group that has been playing together their whole lives. This group of seniors has gone 23-1 as upperclassmen and has improved a lot since the start of last season. The lone loss was on a last-second FG at Rancho Cotate (which has been excellent) in last year's playoffs after EHS was a whisker away from just running out the clock with a time-consuming drive (before some officiating high jinks popped up and extended a helping hand to the home team).

It's always interesting to see how coaches react to making the trek north into Humboldt or Del Norte County for a playoff game. It's incredible how often there will be postgame quotes from a losing Bay Area coach about A) the travel (as if all the H-DN teams don't have to travel the same distance down all the time) and/or B) the weather/playing conditions. Sure enough, I read a couple quotes in an East Bay Times article published Sunday that fit this mold: Las Lomas' coach called Eureka High's Albee Stadium "unplayable" and M-A's coach accused Eureka High of being untruthful about the field conditions.

News flash, guys: they still play football games on grass and football games aren't canceled due to rain/mud. Albee Stadium was very wet between the hashes last weekend, but that tends to happen when a storm rolls through. The field is also in a small ravine. Both teams had to deal with the conditions. In fact, it was Eureka that lost FIVE fumble before halftime (two deep in LL territory when about to score and two deep in its own territory without allowing points). LL couldn't score and Eureka still managed a 21-0 win (that easily could've been of the 35+ to 0 variety) over a team that had been dominant all season.

This game has since been moved to McKinleyville High (an additional 20 minutes north of EHS), which is on a bluff over the ocean. It's a flat piece of land, so it should be less wet/muddy, but it'll still be plenty wet if there's more rain this week, and it's grass. It also gets extremely foggy there at times. I've been to games at Mack that were legitimately like the infamous Fog Bowl game.

Anyway, it's always interesting to think about how the team traveling up there will react. Will they make excuses in advance? Will they wilt because they're not playing on dry, pristine artificial turf? Will they look at this as a challenge and use it as further motivation? I know M-A is pissed about having to travel while Wilcox is playing a home game.

I think it'll be a good game and, assuming it can avoid losing a bunch of turnovers again, the inclement weather should help Eureka. And it has rolled everyone this season, including all the playoff teams it has faced. I'm rally excited to see what happens, but I'm not sure what result would surprise me. I'd probably be most surprised by a lopsided M-A win even though it has a ton of talent. History has shown that Bay Area teams don't handle travel and the wet grass fields of H-DN country well. I mean, their coaches tell us as much after these types of games.

Some good stuff.....Looking forward to your comments following the game.
 
It's funny you mention that game because while thinking about Eureka vs. M-A those 2010 games popped into my mind. I remember relishing Escalon kicking Madison's butt up and down the field when conditions were especially wet.

Sometimes it rains and fields get muddy, even if it's an NFL field. I find it almost incredible when people complain about a muddy football field. I understand that field turf football fields are de rigueur throughout the Bay Area, but I guess I underestimate how quickly people can become accustomed to always playing on field turf.

This isn't basketball or baseball, sometimes you have to play in terrible conditions. And if a team can only win when things are going just right and in optimal conditions for success, then maybe they aren't so great. Sometimes you have to "overcome" an obstacle such as a muddy field.

The funny part about their complaints was that those kids had played 2 games in their HS careers on REAL grass (Jesuit, who got synthetic about 6 years ago and Casa Roble who just got synthetic this year) and the one time it rained hard was against Vacaville (it was like a monsoon type rain!) and Folsom was up 75-0 at halftime of that one! HAHA

But heck, we didn't know any better, it was our 1st SBG and probably our 1st game south of Atwater! If it was going to rain, let it rain! We were just happy to be there!
 
The funny part about their complaints was that those kids had played 2 games in their HS careers on REAL grass (Jesuit, who got synthetic about 6 years ago and Casa Roble who just got synthetic this year) and the one time it rained hard was against Vacaville (it was like a monsoon type rain!) and Folsom was up 75-0 at halftime of that one! HAHA

But heck, we didn't know any better, it was our 1st SBG and probably our 1st game south of Atwater! If it was going to rain, let it rain! We were just happy to be there!

That game was over before it started. I remember watching the Serra players walk on the field like a dog that was given socks. They were trying to keep their feet up, somehow thinking they wouldn't get wet that way. I knew right then that Folsom had them.
 
Would love to see a close game and Eureka is a long trip and its going to be wet. Conditions they play in well. That is a huge advantage if you ask me. I think its a sloppy game in the 21-14 range. But hoping that Eureka pulls off the upset. Would be nice for that town.
 
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"I think it will be M/A in a cakewalk. Assuming they don’t shoot them selves in the foot as they sometimes do. The question is is who starts at QB for M/A?"

Has to be the freshmen who came in and gave them the spark v Wilcox. They looked dead in the water until he came in. I think the starter threw one touchdown but Troy Franklin made a heck of a toe tapping catch in the endzone. They couldnt complete a ball besides that until they turned to the Freshman MacLeod
 
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In reference to the Folsom- Serra game, Serra came out all wearing illegal three quarter inch length cleats ( which was brought to the attention of the officials by the Folsom coaching staff)!! Serra was directed to change their cleats prior to the start of the game- and lo and behold they just happened to have a bunch of one half inch cleats around!!!
 
My question is how and when will MA make the drive ? Is coach going to try to drive and play in the same day? ( big mistake ) let’s hope they travel a day early have a good team dinner watch some film have a nice early curfew get a good nights sleep. Wake up team breakfast a light walk though more films followed by team lunch get some rest then STRAP’EM ON & get it done.
 
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My question is how and when will MA make the drive ? Is coach going to try to drive and play in the same day? ( big mistake ) let’s hope they travel a day early have a good team dinner watch some film have a nice early curfew get a good nights sleep. Wake up team breakfast a light walk though more films followed by team lunch get some rest then STRAP’EM ON & get it done.

Nah I’d just leave 10ish from the South Bay on Saturday. Nice scenic drive. Stopoff at the Somoa Cookhouse for late afternoon heavy heavy lunch / dinner then to Mckinleyville hop off the bus and kickoff.
 
Nah I’d just leave 10ish from the South Bay on Saturday. Nice scenic drive. Stopoff at the Somoa Cookhouse for late afternoon heavy heavy lunch / dinner then to Mckinleyville hop off the bus and kickoff.

Wellll.......it's pretty obvious where this week's allowance and lunch money is going. Are you taking the overs/unders or going with the spread..?
 
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Nah I’d just leave 10ish from the South Bay on Saturday. Nice scenic drive. Stopoff at the Somoa Cookhouse for late afternoon heavy heavy lunch / dinner then to Mckinleyville hop off the bus and kickoff.
Somoa Cookhouse - now that's the place for a team lunch!!!! Home styled one menu for all with unlimited eats - I'm hungry just thinking about it!
 
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This writer gives a lot of credence to the high school sports playoff seeding process. Sending the best remaining seed would've been just as much of a sham, especially considering Cardinal Newman got the ol' SEC football treatment in which it was credited for a "good" loss as opposed to Eureka's no losses (and that's not to say I have an issue with CN being the top seed because they're excellent and that loss is pretty much beyond reproach).

Using head-to-head as a tiebreaker when possible is one thing, but when you've got the top two seeds which were equally dominant and posted the same results against common opponents (both beat Fortuna by 29 while they beat Ukiah by 31 and 28, respectively), you don't choose a section champ based on pre-playoff seeding decided by people sitting in a room or on the phone.

It stinks that it came down to a coin toss, but once that was an option it was still an option. Eureka wanting to play rather than coin toss and getting to continue playing is simply poetic justice.

On the other hand, it also stinks that Fortuna could win another section title this weekend and not get to play for back-to-back state titles. The NCS screwed up a bunch throughout this process, and its final boner was letting one team determine whether or not there'd be a coin flip when it should've taken both teams asking for a flip for one to take place. It really should be Cardinal Newman-Eureka this weekend. The regional/state bowl system is such a crapshoot outside the open division anyway that it bugs me that the NCS basically said, yeah, the state games are more important and are the default priority, all it takes is one team wanting a toss for us to A) not play a section title game and B) not crown a section champ.
 
This writer gives a lot of credence to the high school sports playoff seeding process. Sending the best remaining seed would've been just as much of a sham, especially considering Cardinal Newman got the ol' SEC football treatment in which it was credited for a "good" loss as opposed to Eureka's no losses (and that's not to say I have an issue with CN being the top seed because they're excellent and that loss is pretty much beyond reproach).

Using head-to-head as a tiebreaker when possible is one thing, but when you've got the top two seeds which were equally dominant and posted the same results against common opponents (both beat Fortuna by 29 while they beat Ukiah by 31 and 28, respectively), you don't choose a section champ based on pre-playoff seeding decided by people sitting in a room or on the phone.

It stinks that it came down to a coin toss, but once that was an option it was still an option. Eureka wanting to play rather than coin toss and getting to continue playing is simply poetic justice.

On the other hand, it also stinks that Fortuna could win another section title this weekend and not get to play for back-to-back state titles. The NCS screwed up a bunch throughout this process, and its final boner was letting one team determine whether or not there'd be a coin flip when it should've taken both teams asking for a flip for one to take place. It really should be Cardinal Newman-Eureka this weekend. The regional/state bowl system is such a crapshoot outside the open division anyway that it bugs me that the NCS basically said, yeah, the state games are more important and are the default priority, all it takes is one team wanting a toss for us to A) not play a section title game and B) not crown a section champ.
Eureka's AD was the one that proposed and motioned the last minute coin toss option
 
My question is how and when will MA make the drive ? Is coach going to try to drive and play in the same day? ( big mistake ) let’s hope they travel a day early have a good team dinner watch some film have a nice early curfew get a good nights sleep. Wake up team breakfast a light walk though more films followed by team lunch get some rest then STRAP’EM ON & get it done.

My guess would be that M-A is leaving Thursday and spending the night. I mean, if it's a big deal to travel that far the last thing you want to do is hop off the bus after six hours and walk right onto the field.

I'm really surprised the game is on Friday. Why would the team traveling the longest distance for a regional game play on a weekday? They could leave after school on Friday (or Saturday morning) and play on the weekend? This really doesn't make sense.
 
Eureka's AD was the one that proposed and motioned the last minute coin toss option

That's fine. And of course they suggested a coin flip if the NCS was eager (as mentioned in the article) to just send the best remaining seed onto the regional bowl, which would've ended Eureka's season. It sounds like the Eureka AD saved Eureka's season by giving the school a 50/50 chance at continuing rather than no chance.

Like I said, it was still an option and one that was ultimately only chosen by one finalist - Cardinal Newman. Eureka's team was intent on playing for a section title the whole time.
 
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That's fine. And of course they suggested a coin flip if the NCS was eager (as mentioned in the article) to just send the best remaining seed onto the regional bowl, which would've ended Eureka's season. It sounds like the Eureka AD saved Eureka's season by giving the schoo, a 50/50 chance at continuing rather than no chance.

Like I said, it was still an option and one that was ultimately only chosen by one finalist - Cardinal Newman. Eureka's team was intent on playing for a section title the whole time.
Yes the only group of men willing to make the sacrifice of their season. And they will remember that Eureka benefitted from their desire to have a chance at the ultimate prize. Hopefully, they take advantage of that opportunity.
 
That's an interesting way too look at it. I'm confident Eureka will represent the section well win or lose. Either way, it's a shame that the history books will have a blank space where it should list this year's NCS Division 3 champion.
 
Didn’t even look to notice game is on. Friday? Assumed it would be Saturday, well because that makes sense for sevral reasons. Geez the NCS is run by idiots.
 
That's an interesting way too look at it. I'm confident Eureka will represent the section well win or lose. Either way, it's a shame that the history books will have a blank space where it should list this year's NCS Division 3 champion.
Because that's they way it was looked at from the other side of the fence. It wasn't an anti-Eureka decision, it was a pro-opportunity to play for state decision
 
Because that's they way it was looked at from the other side of the fence. It wasn't an anti-Eureka decision, it was a pro-opportunity to play for state decision

Oh, I never claimed there was any anti-Eureka bias in any of this coin flip nonsense, it was just a cluster all the way through thanks to the NCS powers that be. As stated previously, giving the schools the choice between playing for the section title or flipping a coin to move on beats simply skipping the title game and sending the better seed in my eyes.

I guess I don't see CN's "sacrifice" quite like you do, but I don't begrudge them the choice. It's certainly not their fault it got to the point where they had to choose between section or state. I also find the state bowl system to be a cluster in its own right because it is so far from a true state tournament and the regional/state matchups can be awfully convoluted. I could care less about state football titles, the section playoffs are (as someone else around here recently put it) a more "pure" competition.

Schools have been competing for NCS titles since 1975, and Cardinal Newman won the first two 3A Redwood Empire trophies. I wish they (and many, many others, I'm not singling them out) had more reverence for section titles. In their defense, they've won a bunch of NCS titles and played for a state title before, so I can see how that would impact a program's POV.
 
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Oh, I never claimed there was any anti-Eureka bias in any of this coin flip nonsense, it was just a cluster all the way through thanks to the NCS powers that be. As stated previously, giving the schools the choice between playing for the section title or flipping a coin to move on beats simply skipping the title game and sending the better seed in my eyes.

I guess I don't see CN's "sacrifice" quite like you do, but I don't begrudge them the choice. It's certainly not their fault it got to the point where they had to choose between section or state. I also find the state bowl system to be a cluster in its own right because it is so far from a true state tournament and the regional/state matchups can be awfully convoluted. I could care less about state football titles, the section playoffs are (as someone else around here recently put it) a more "pure" competition.

Schools have been competing for NCS titles since 1975, and Cardinal Newman won the first two 3A Redwood Empire trophies. I wish they (and many, many others, I'm not singling them out) had more reverence for section titles. In their defense, they've won a bunch of NCS titles and played for a state title before, so I can see how that would impact a program's POV.
I don’t know many schools that hold a section Championship in higher regard than a State Championship. Most schools decisions were based on fear of not playing at all.
 
Eureka also choose to play it out with CN, but was forced to the coin flip by CN's choosing.
A Coinflip is a terrible idea for many reasons but the most important being that it took away any motivation for the lower seeds to keep playoffs on track. All those schools have been eliminated from competition and none are subject to impact of their decision
 
I don’t know many schools that hold a section Championship in higher regard than a State Championship. Most schools decisions were based on fear of not playing at all.

It wasn't even so much about what's bigger/better/more important, it was a matter of, "Do we want to compete for a section title by playing a game that we earned our place in, or do we want to skip this section title game as if it's secondary and flip a coin hoping we might have a chance to play in a regional game that only presents more questions?"

No doubt state titles trump section titles, but the way the matchups are made is far from clear-cut. The state bowls have been around for just over a decade and initially there were three games. Now we have 13 state title games and 26 regional bowls (when possible) to determine the participants. It's simply not a well-oiled machine and not something I feel merits a coin flip and bypassing the NCS title game.

I'm glad Divisions 1, 2, 4 and 5 are playing for section titles rather than allowing seasons to disappear like a fart in the wind when the state bowl system isn't exactly a great measurement of the best teams in the state. If it were, we'd know well in advance which matchups we'd see in each regional bowl game based on section final results. Instead, we have a hearing to figure out how all these puzzle pieces can be pieced together in matchups that maybe kinda sorta make sense, and only after section championship games are played.

If "fear of not playing at all" motivated the decisions these programs made to either play or flip a coin, choosing to flip a coin that could end your season only increases the likelihood of not playing at all. A team afraid of seeing its season end off the field likely doesn't choose a coin flip that only ensures that precise thing will happen for one team or the other.
 
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