MMC no match for Modesto Christian

[Streak One]

In the league opener, Modesto Christian beat Johansen 77-4. Not good for anyone involved.

Here is a good look at the experience Modesto Christian brought back - http://www.modbee.com/sports/high-school/article124438514.html

 

[cptmycpa]

In the league opener, Modesto Christian beat Johansen 77-4. Not good for anyone involved.

Here is a good look at the experience Modesto Christian brought back - http://www.modbee.com/sports/high-school/article124438514.html

How about this score from yesterday, Tuesday, January 3:
West Campus 93, Lindhurst 3 -- not a typo.

http://www.maxpreps.com/games/girls...st-campus/1-3-2017-Ujlow2pV402QuJBo9rYQFg.htm

 

[Streak One]

Yeah games like this have no place in athletics. Have to create better balance, though that is a very difficult task

 

[Paytc]

Yeah games like this have no place in athletics. Have to create better balance, though that is a very difficult task

When you know your team can't hang they should forfeit the game and ask to play the better team's freshman or jv team. Because I don't think a good team should stop playing good ball at the mercy of an inferior team because that could lead to injury.

 

[mkbgdns]

that could lead to injury.

not arguing, just don't understand the logic

 

[Paytc]

not arguing, just don't understand the logic

Not every time but many times I have seen players get hurt trying to slow down or alter their game. Kind of like the freak accident Bo Jackson suffered when he was not in football shape after coming from another sport. I just dont think you punish better players because others can't hang with them. I always say get better or get out of the game if it's over your skill level. Or deal with embarrassing lopsided games like that. That may or may not make sense because logic doesn't always apply under illogical circumstances. Hope that helps if not perhaps I need the help. LOL...........

I'm not saying go out and intentionally try to hurt or play in a mean spirited classless way. But run your game. Who knows perhaps 93 to 3 was taking it easy and it could have been 278 to 0? Or same thing with the other score 77-4 could have been 198-2?

 

[Sjbasket]

i don't believe anyone wants to purposely embarrass anyone. Maybe pad their stats? Maybe see if they can score 100?

There should be some due diligence in regards to keeping games on the schedule against teams that currently just don't possess the skill or talent to match up.

Lastly, Bo Jackson was an absolute specimen. He was in excellent physical condition. That injury took place in a playoff game, well into the season. Freak injury.

 

[Azanna]

There in the same league, what are you going to do? The problem is the SJS doesn't take into consideration levels of talent

 

[Streak One]

Is it possible to have sport specific leagues? Keep them geographically close together but allow West Campus girls to go to the Metro or MC girls go to VOL for basketball ( being talked about for next realignment) for example

 

[ClayK]

It's a very complicated situation. First and maybe foremost, there is limited administrative time available in high school sports. Schools have been hammered by voters and the media to eliminate administrators and spend the money on teachers – this is fine, but there's a price to be paid.

Second, just because there's a mismatch in one sport doesn't mean there's a mismatch in all the others. I have no idea about the specifics in the situations referred to, but I do know that a school with a weak girls' basketball program may have a very strong boys' basketball program, and a strong football program as well. So when it comes to setting up leagues, all sports have to be considered. (And this is where the administrative time comes in, because setting up a different league for every sport would not only be complicated to begin with, making it work in terms of transportation and scheduling would be far from simple.)

Third, geography is an issue as well. Getting students from one place to another is not inexpensive, and driving past three or four high schools to play a game 30 miles away doesn't really make sense. And it's not just cost – while the kids are sitting in the vans of the bus, they're not able to study and losing 90 minutes or two hours to travel every game means students sometimes have to leave school early, or get back home very late.

As always, nothing is ever as simple as it seems. I remember one year at Bentley I looked at the schedule and saw four straight 40-point losses coming up. But given the realities of the situation, there really weren't any options – and I think that's what's happening here.

If we had a bunch of administrators who had the time to sit in long meetings and work through all of these details, we might be able to avoid these kinds of routs. But right now, that's simply asking too much of people who are already working a lot of hours for not very much pay.

 

[mkbgdns]

I have seen players get hurt trying to slow down or alter their game

so you're basing your statement on personal, anecdotal observation. personally, I've seen kids get hurt playing all-out. it doesn't make sense to me that not pressing, walking the ball up in transition, playing a soft zone with no ball denial on the perimeter, not following your shot, not contesting a rebound that's 60/40 to your opponent, not going for the steal--any of those things--makes your team more vulnerable to injury.

a coach on the better team faces a tough choice. to continue to have your team "groove" good habits that can make a difference in a close game, and humiliate your opponent, or to slack off, possibly open the door to bad habits, but exhibit (and model) compassion toward an overmatched opponent. the choice is not obvious either way, but I don't think injury risk is a factor. "I didn't want to win by 80, I had to in order to protect my kids' health." please.

paradoxically, a really elite team (most likely to inflict a blowout) has the most incentive to maximize every possession for it's possible minute advantage down the road against an elite opponent, possibly in a section, Norcal, or state championship game. the contest may turn on a play made by a kid that was reflex, not calculated.

 

[Paytc]

so you're basing your statement on personal, anecdotal observation. personally, I've seen kids get hurt playing all-out. it doesn't make sense to me that not pressing, walking the ball up in transition, playing a soft zone with no ball denial on the perimeter, not following your shot, not contesting a rebound that's 60/40 to your opponent, not going for the steal--any of those things--makes your team more vulnerable to injury.

a coach on the better team faces a tough choice. to continue to have your team "groove" good habits that can make a difference in a close game, and humiliate your opponent, or to slack off, possibly open the door to bad habits, but exhibit (and model) compassion toward an overmatched opponent. the choice is not obvious either way, but I don't think injury risk is a factor.

paradoxically, a really elite team (most likely to inflict a blowout) has the most incentive to maximize every game minute for it's possible minute advantage down the road against an elite opponent.

Thanks for sharing that opinion. You could be right. I just don't believe a team or great player should slow down so others can catch up. If you want to do something kind have the team go together and help feed the homeless or volunteer at a old folks home.

I would have to be at a game to form an opinion based in fact that a team was intentionally running a score up. I don't think the score board always tells a complete and true story. As I said 77-4 could have been the taking it easy with the team score. And that same score could have been 198-2 had they tried to run the score up on them?

 

[jaymel911]

On a one off basis I agree with MK but the issue is what do you do the next night and then the following night and of course the next week. Anyone can show compassion and ease back but to ask teams to that each and every night, that is not reasonable.

If administrators care about it then they should prevent it from happening. There is no reason for those two teams to play. The league schedule does not have the founding father's signature on it. These league commissioners are paid positions, come up with a proposal to eliminate these games. It really is not difficult. Clayk can argue dynamics of this sport or that sport but it is simple, do not have them play. the coaches will tell you that neither want to play so scrap the game and give them both a non conference contact to schedule someone.

 

[mkbgdns]

jaymel--to be clear, I wasn't advocating letting up--only that injury risk is not a factor, and that it's a judgment call, and that there are good reasons for a good team to want to stay sharp, even against an overmatched opponent. buddha wouldn't hesitate picking compassion, but he wasn't a basketball coach. if you see him on a team's bench, kill him.

 

[bodyguard]

As far as due diligence regarding the rules. The coach of the losing team can request a running clock after halftime if trialing by 40 or more. If trailing by 40 or more in the 4th the running clock is automatically implemented. Of course this doesn't necessarily stop these scores from occurring.

As far as injuries, often when playing a team that has little skill they tend to play more out of control, not intentionally, just because they are at such a low level as far as basketball skill and athletic control. Also, when a team gets down by a huge margin sometimes frustration sets in and the fouls get harder. Not necessarily trying to injure, just desperate to stop the team from continually scoring.

A few years ago had a girl tear her ACL after being pushed under the basket on a breakaway by another player. The game wasn't a blowout but the player wasn't very athletic and was trying to make a desperate attempt to stop her from scoring and in the moment pushed her. We know she meant no intentional harm because this was a kid we had known for years and had trained and played with our girls. She felt terrible afterward, but it happens, the body reacts impulsively when panicked. Another reason to teach the two-foot jump stop on layups unless all alone.

 

[jaymel911]

jaymel--to be clear, I wasn't advocating letting up--only that injury risk is not a factor, and that it's a judgment call, and that there are good reasons for a good team to want to stay sharp, even against an overmatched opponent. buddha wouldn't hesitate picking compassion, but he wasn't a basketball coach. if you see him on a team's bench, kill him.

I agree with your post. I also think the leagues and administrators need to do a better job of avoiding these things. They have the power to change the leagues accordingly and they should do so.

 

[ClayK]

Actually, league alignments are set by the sections, and are locked into a two- and four-year cycle. And they are voted on before being passed, though that didn't stop a team like St. Joseph Notre Dame being dropped into the BCL-East, where they will win every game by at least 40. No one wants SJND in that league, but unless the games are cancelled and not played at all (which no one wants to do either), the decision by NCS and the Bay Area Conference dooms SJND and the other teams to two years of ugly mismatches.

Why did SJND wind up in that league? Because the previous head of school wanted SJND to be associated with higher-rated academic schools such as Head-Royce, College Prep, Athenian and Bentley to help enrollment. And now a lot of teams in a lot of sports are paying the price ...

 

[Streak One]

Good insight Clay on the SJND move. That was certainly a head scratcher.

 

[Willtalk]

--------------------------------------------------As far as injuries, often when playing a team that has little skill they tend to play more out of control, not intentionally, just because they are at such a low level as far as basketball skill and athletic control. Also, when a team gets down by a huge margin sometimes frustration sets in and the fouls get harder. Not necessarily trying to injure, just desperate to stop the team from continually scoring.------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------.

You are spot on in your assessment. I have seen this happen quite a few times myself. I tried to explain that very point to a friend of mine who insisted they were doing it purposefully. They are basically hard out of control fouls or the undercutting an air born shooter by a slower player.