NorCal OPEN Division candidates

[Stance1]

If the committee decides to fill the 8-team NorCal OPEN division bracket like they did last year, who are the automatics and teams likely to fill the spots?

Below is a list of the top 25 in Northern California with their current record and state rankings. I realize some of them do not qualify for the OPEN division due to lack of recent past success. There is a limit of 4 teams from any given section. Also, how the games go this week will have a lot to say with how it will play out.

Does anyone know if a section runner-up can make it over the same-section champion if they have had a better overall season? For example, if someone like Antelope upset Sacramento for the SJS Division 2 title, could they take Sacramento in the OPEN division without taking Antelope? Would that be allowed by rule?

Provided these teams finish strong, and at least make their section title games, here is my guess on the Open Division.

Sac Joaquin Section
1. Folsom
2. Modesto Christian/Sheldon semifinal game winner (maybe both)
3. Sacramento

Central Coast Section
1. St. Francis (CCS)
2. Serra (CCS)

North Coast Section
1. De LaSalle (NCS)
2. Moreau Catholic (NCS)

If these 7 teams make it, would they take a 4th team from the SJS like the Modesto Christian/Sheldon loser, or would they go with an Oakland Tech or Salesian? It should be a great tournament as just about every team listed above could beat each other.

State
Rank Team Record Section
6 St. Francis 24-2 CCS
10 Folsom 26-3 SJS
13 Sheldon 22-4 SJS
14 De LaSalle 26-2 NCS
15 Modesto Christian 28-1 SJS
16 Serra 21-4 CCS
17 Sacramento 27-1 SJS
23 Salesian 26-4 NCS
31 Jesuit 25-4 SJS
34 Freedom 23-5 NCS--eliminated
36 Oakland Tech 26-2 OAK
38 Weston Ranch 25-4 SJS
44 Woodcreek 20-4 SJS--eliminated
48 Bellarmine 17-7 CCS
49 Mitty 14-11 CCS
54 Manteca 24-5 SJS
59 Half Moon Bay 25-3 CCS
60 Menlo Atherton 25-3 CCS
61 Granite Bay 20-9 SJS
63 Moreau Catholic 23-4 NCS
64 Doherty Valley 25-3 NCS
66 Monte Vista 22-6 NCS
69 Palma 22-3 CCS
72 Heritage 21-6 NCS--eliminated
75 El Cerrito 18-13 NCS

 

[observer22]

Dougherty Valley has also been eliminated from Open consideration.

Since Monte Vista, El Cerrito & BOD all made it to the Open last year, should any of them win their section I would think they would qualify again this year, and I suppose it's possible 1 or more could qualify even with a finals loss. If a section runner up qualifies and the section winner doesn't and doesn't apply (like MV 2 years ago), then yes your scenario could very well take place. And if more than 8 qualify, they'll have some decisions to make.

If a team doesn't qualify, they would have to apply to be in the Open. Assuming that all 7 of your teams above qualify, then they would just need 1 more team to fill the bracket and it may be an Oakland Tech or Salesian. But if a couple of teams stumble, they may reach in and grab someone who qualifies but may not be a threat this year. Still a lot of great hoops to be played in the coming week before this goes down.

 

[Shooter510]

Both EC and Newark are open qualified regardless of how section tournament plays out. Both have qualified for NorCal 3 out of past 4 years, this year included.

With that being said, if either wins section I don't think committee would pull them....or would they...

 

[TheyCall Me Coach]

I bet Modesto Christian and Sheldon both make it giving the open 4 from Sac, and the other 4 from the first post, MC, SERRA, St. Francis and De La round it out

 

[Streak One]

Open is fairly easy this year. 7 Locks:

De La Salle
Moreau Catholic
2 SJS D1 finalists (Sheldon, Modesto Christian, Folsom)
Sacramento
St. Francis
Serra

Questions will be do they take 3 teams from the SJS D1 field to get to 8? Or move Salesian up? Or play with 7?

 

[laidbackcoach]

Streak, u do not think Moreau Catholic has a shot?

 

[observer22]

He may have typed in Monte Vista but meant Moreau.

 

[Streak One]

Yes, was looking at the D1 bracket and typing that.

 

[H.E.A.T.]

Why is no-one even hinting at Jesuit. They are 25-4 with a 9 point victory over Woodcreek.

 

[Streak One]

Coming into the week, I think Jesuit was on the outside. With Serra losing last night, Jesuit could be pulled up, but definitely need to win tonight

 

[TwitterLegend]

Serra losing potentially changes everything... I get that they still may be taken for the Open but I don't really like seeing a team get picked for Open if they lose to a team that won't/shouldn't be in the Open... Like if Modesto loses to Sheldon, they both deserve to be in the Open, this is not the same case...

 

[youseechief]

why no Jesuit you ask? Because Sac High is an open team and without a win tonight, there are 3 better D1 teams.

 

[BBClayman]

Does El Cerrito have any shot of going open?

 

[SmoothJay]

Does El Cerrito have any shot of going open?

El Cerrito has lost 3 times to Salesian this year. How would they get picked before Salesian?

 

[Dgdollaz]

Saw a tweet that said the winner of Folsom/MC on Saturday will get at least a 2 seed in the Open bracket.

 

[youseechief]

I'd think the winner would be the 1 seed and loser shouldn't drop lower than 3

 

[TwitterLegend]

Not sure if either would be eligible, but how about the winner of Weston Ranch/Manteca in SJS D3 as a darkhorse candidate for the last open spot???

 

[hoopman2015]

What about if Newark beats EC (again) to win D2? They've already beaten Moreau, Woodcreek, EC, and Capital Christian this year.

 

[Dgdollaz]

All these schools you guys are naming will get an 8 seed if they magically get into the Open. Then they play MC/Folsom/DLS/Sac and get blown out the first game. Not something to wish for.

 

[TwitterLegend]

There are 6 locks as of right now:
Modesto Christian, Folsom, Sac High, Moreau Catholic, De La Salle, St. Francis...

Potential candidates for last 2 spots:
Monte Vista, Salesian, Newark, El Cerrito, Sheldon, Weston Ranch, Manteca, Bellarmine, Serra, Oakland Tech....

I think if Salesian wins NCS, they are in... Also, would guess if Bellarmine or Monte Vista pull the upset and win, they are in... Should be an interesting selection process this year!

 

[H.E.A.T.]

It seems Monte Vista is more of a lock than DLS. Isn't MV trying to 3 peat as NCS D1 champs.

 

[noknight]

With the discussion of seeding - thought I'd point out the latest MaxPreps Northern California Top 25 Rankings (came out yesterday):

http://www.maxpreps.com/news/YAzXup...ia-top-25-high-school-basketball-rankings.htm

1 - De La Salle
2 - Moreau Catholic
3 - Sacramento
4 - Folsom
5 - Modesto Christian
6 - Sheldon
7 - St. Francis
8 - Jesuit
9 - Serra
10 - Salesian
11 - Weston Ranch
12 - Newark Memorial
13 - Monte Vista
14 - Manteca
15 - Bellarmine

Neither El Cerrito or Oakland Tech are listed in the Top 25.

Based on this, I don't see any way the loser of Folsom/Modesto Christian falls "no lower than a 3 seed."

 

[infofreak]

I normally would agree but I've watched the maxprep rankings get ignored time and again when seeds are handed out.

 

[NSBasketball]

If Monte Vista wins the NCS they will go Open in Nor Cal's... They have to, they were in the Open last year.

 

[observer22]

If Monte Vista wins the NCS they will go Open in Nor Cal's... They have to, they were in the Open last year.

They don't have to, but probably would get in. Remember, EC and Newark also qualify so NCS will have at least 6 teams that qualify in DLS, MC, MV, Salesian, Newark & EC. At least 2 of them will be left out if not 4. Will have to see how the games pan out this weekend. If DLS and MC both win, they seem to be the only NCS locks, but if there are upsets in NCS or the other sections this weekend it could wreck havoc on the Open bracket.

 

[BillyBob023]

In my opinion the following teams are locks for the Open Division: Folsom, Modesto Christian, Sacramento, DLS, Moreau Catholic, Salesian, St Francis.

On the bubble: Sheldon, Monte Vista, Newark, and Serra.

Question: How can the CCS only send one representative to the Open?

As Observer22 has pointed out, section final upsets could further muddle the waters.

 

[Streak One]

I really hope they don't go to 8. As the conversation as shown over the last few weeks, there is a clear line in the sand at 6.

 

[TwitterLegend]

I'd still rather see 8 teams for a full bracket, not fair to give a couple teams a bye, like to see everyone play the same amount of games...

 

[noknight]

I'd still rather see 8 teams for a full bracket, not fair to give a couple teams a bye, like to see everyone play the same amount of games...

I would rather if the Open Bracket were configured such that teams that get eliminated from it fall back into their division brackets in some way - at least in the first round.

 

[observer22]

I would rather if the Open Bracket were configured such that teams that get eliminated from it fall back into their division brackets in some way - at least in the first round.

I like it. 1st round Open losers slide into the 2nd round of their own divisional brackets, and 2nd round Open losers fall into the 3rd round of their divisional brackets. Then, just the 2 Open finalists would be left with the winners of Norcal and SoCal facing off for the official State Open Champion or Gold and Silver medalists, and then let the runners up in NorCal and SoCal face each other for the Bronze medal. That 3rd place game would still be 2 great teams facing off with the whole state watching. Better than the current one and done for these 8 elite teams.

 

[Dgdollaz]

The current system isn't perfect but this isn't gonna work at all. The idea sounds refreshing but in CA it won't work. The playoffs run late already as it is now it'll extend even further since teams will play more and get extra chances. I do like the drop back into your division idea tho

 

[observer22]

The current system isn't perfect but this isn't gonna work at all. The idea sounds refreshing but in CA it won't work. The playoffs run late already as it is now it'll extend even further since teams will play more and get extra chances. I do like the drop back into your division idea tho

But if they slide into the next round in the divisional bracket like I mentioned above, there would not be many extra games. It would make the bracket a hell of a challenge to put together though, since you would never know what division the Open teams that lose are going to drop into. Unless of course they all go into the D1 bracket, which if they truly Open worthy they should be able to compete in.

 

[Shooter510]

Does El Cerrito have any shot of going open?

What about if Newark beats EC (again) to win D2? They've already beaten Moreau, Woodcreek, EC, and Capital Christian this year.

LOL. Newark as a 5 seed in NCS division II rolls up to open. Was talking about that earlier with a friend of mine. That would be kind of messed up. It's like now all of a sudden those games mean something for open consideration but didn't mean a lot when getting seeded for sections.

 

[infofreak]

the seedings for sections was terrible, at least is ncs Div 1 and 2. The current status of semi's and finals for those divisions bear that out.

what is described above though in terms of dropping back if losing in the open does sound like it would make for some great drama. Wow.

 

[Shooter510]

the seedings for sections was terrible, at least is ncs Div 1 and 2. The current status of semi's and finals for those divisions bear that out.

what is described above though in terms of dropping back if losing in the open does sound like it would make for some great drama. Wow.

Lol yes laughable. But hey after initial displeasure...if you can't beat team x on the road in section probably don't have business being in NorCal anyway. Cream will rise.

Were their any other sections that had seeding messed up at least in the eyes of those of us on here? Just curious. Seems as NCS marches to a different drum. Weren't they the only section that voted against open and new transfer rules. It's almost like they nominate teams for NorCal to say, "...see this doesn't work..."

 

[H.E.A.T.]

Noknight....... The Nor cal max prep rankins are just Joe Davidson of the Sacramento Bee Rankings and completely different than the rest of the computer generated rankings.Look at the rankinhs at the top of the thread. On Monday St francis was the highest state ranked team at #6 but only #7 in Norcal ranks

 

[infofreak]

HEAT, are you saying the Norcal Max Prep rankings (as shown above and referenced as being created by the Sac Bee) are done by a human, but the balance of the MaxPrep ranks are done by computer?
Thanks in advance

 

[H.E.A.T.]

I never said created by the Sac Bee. I said created by Joe Davidson of the Sac bee

 

[TurtleLoveCA]

I don't believe that Bellarmine has any shot at Open nor should they be considered. They finished FOUR GAMES behind Serra in the regular season and lost both regular season games to them. Winning Open Division in CCS doesn't qualify any team automatically for anything. Of course, all Open teams automatically qualify for the Northern California championships.

 

[TwitterLegend]

I would think the exact opposite Turtlelove... I think winning the CCS open should obviously qualify you for the open... its like a small conference tourney in ncaa, just cuz a team has a great regular season, if they lose in the tournament (ccs playoffs in this case), the team that beats them gets the bid... common sense