St Joe’s PIlots v. Cardinal Newman

[kiddman32]

Just a few minutes til tipoff of the NCS Open girls’ hoops final!

St. Joe’s of Alameda takes on Cardinal Newman of Santa Rosa...

Headliner for Newman is UCSB-bound Anya Choice, who went off for over 30 points in the 2nd half the other day vs. Salesian, 43 points total.

St. Joe’s has four girls averaging over 9ppg according to MaxPreps.

An aside whilst we wait... this is the first time I’ve ever sat in the first row of the scorers’ side upper level at this gym... Can’t get much more perfect than this spot...

 

[kiddman32]

Pilots open the scoring with a 3-ball, but CN right back with a 2...

Pilots score inside, 5-2. 5:13 left, CN ball.

Pilots steal, length of the floor drive for 2... A steal, and a 3-ball goes! 10-2 Pilots, time out CN... 4:21 left 1st.

 

[kiddman32]

Sorry, don’t have names of any players other than Choice... Hard to hear in here, too...

Anyway, Pilots score again after a CN turnover... 12-2.

CN sinks a pair at the line... Choice chooses to drive and score... 12-6. Pilots spin move travel... CN ball, 2:48 left... CN travels... LOTS of turnovers here!

 

[kiddman32]

CN drive and score after a long rebound... 12-8.

Nice speed changes on a CN drive ... 12-10.

And a 3-ball, CN takes the lead! 13-12.

Score inside by the Pilots... and a CN charge call... 14-13 Pilots... Pilots ball now, 19 secs left... Airball on a 3. CN has 12 secs to get a shot... They get off a good-looking ball that does NOT drop!. Quarter ends 14-13 Pilots.

 

[kiddman32]

Pilots score a 3 to start things off in the 2nd... 17-13, this after some wild end-to-end craziness...

Nice inside dish for 2 by CN... 17-15.

Pilots #1 fouled on a shot... FT’s go. 19-15.

Pilots #2 knocks down a 3! 22-15.

CN #14 returns the favor... 22-18.

 

[kiddman32]

Anya Choice made a bad choice and got her 3rd foul...

(Okay, enuff with the choice puns).

 

[kiddman32]

CN #4 hits a 3! 22-21.

Terrific hi-lo pass inside for a Pilots score... 24-21.

CN fouled, #11 at the line for 2... FT’s clanked.

1:09 left, CN gets ball on a Pilots rebounding foul...

Make that 1 and 1... front end missed.

CN finally knocks down an FT... One more, nope. 24-22...

Pilots unable to execute, lose ball... CN gets a successful putback at the buzzer! And fouled, and sinks the FT. Halftime score, 25-24 CN.

 

[kiddman32]

Pilots #10 gets a steal under her own basket, drives length of the floor and scores... CN coach prolly tearing her hair out about now... 26-25 Pilots.

Niiice dribble-handoff play for a Pilots score, 28-25... but CN scores inside, is fouled... FT missed. 28-27 Pilots.

Choice gets a layup... 29-28 CN.

And another driving CN score... 31-28.

Pilots #5 drives and scores... 31-30, CN by 1... 4:12 left 3rd.

Choice splits a pair at the line... 32-30.

4th foul on Choice... 3:43 left 3rd, Pilots ball.

CN trying to get it downcourt, LOTS of contact from the Pilots, but no call... CN calls time out.

Nice ball fake to get a drive by CN, but Pilots sinks a 3, then get a steal and score on a drive! 35-34 Pilots.

CN #23 fouled on a shot... FT’s go... 36-35 CN.

Terrific drive by Pilots #5 for. Score... but CN #23 nails a 3!! 39-37 CN, 1:28 to go in the 3rd.

 

[kiddman32]

CN #14 fouled... 2 shots. FT’s go. 41-37.

Nice drive for 2 by Pilots #20... Full press on, but CN manages to get it downcourt, #4 scores. 43-39, 12 secs left...

Pilots drive at the hoop gets nuthin’. Quarter ends 43-39 CN.

 

[kiddman32]

CN opens the q with a 3! 46-39.

Pilots #1 drives and scores... 46-41.

Shot clock violation, PIlots ball... 6:50 left.

Nice move down the left side by Pilots #12... 46-43.

CN #23 nails a 3 from... Orinda! Well, 6 feet behind the 3-point line anyway... 49-43. 5:47 left in the ball game.

Pilots #12 drives.. hacked... it goes! One more.. Good. 49-46.

CN throws it out of bounds trying to get thru the press...

PIlots #5 nails a 3 to tie it.. STEAL... #15 airballs a 3.

Score tied, 4:36 left... CN ball.

CN #14 banks one home from 3... Pilots come back and score quickly... 52-51 CN, Pilots have the rock, 3:54 left.

 

[kiddman32]

Pilots call time to avoid a turnover. 3:37 left, CN leads 52-51...

These girls could play all day and all night and it’d still be a nailbiter at the end...

Pilots #1 nails a 3! 54-52 Pilots... CN drives, misses and they get a rebound foul... Choice, who had just come back into the game... That’s her 5th.

 

[kiddman32]

Reverse layup on the backdoor by Pilots #1... AND CN THROWS IT AWAY! And Pilots score again! Suddenly it’s 58-52 Pilots... 2:15 left.

 

[kiddman32]

Nice drive by Pilots #10... 60-52. What a turnaround!

Pilots #10 fouled... 1 and 1, hack n hope city... She nails ‘em both. 62-52.

Ill-advised early shot clock 3 by Pilots #15... No, no, no, nice shot! CN comes back with a 3... 65-55. 50.4 seconds left.

Pilots defensive pressure has proven to be the difference here... Heck of a comeback!

I’ll get the final score after the hackin’ and hopin’ is done...

 

[kiddman32]

Pilots 67, CN 58. Quite a ball game...

 

[GBBall4L]

Pilots 67, CN 58. Quite a ball game...

Thanks for the commentary! I turned it on and CN was up 49-43 then I turned it back on and SJND was up 65-55 with 25 seconds left. I was like wow. Gonna watch it in NFHS tomorrow. Was at the Mitty vs Pinewood game. Thanks again.

 

[observer22]

Thanks for the commentary! I turned it on and CN was up 49-43 then I turned it back on and SJND was up 65-55 with 25 seconds left. I was like wow. Gonna watch it in NFHS tomorrow. Was at the Mitty vs Pinewood game. Thanks again.

It seemed like CN was waiting for Choice to go on a run, but in part due to foul trouble that never happened. The Pilot’s press generated some turnovers and hurried shots by CN.

St. Joe’s has such a well balanced team with everybody contributing. It’s a pleasure to watch them. I thought Pilot reserve guard Harding #1 made a big difference in the game.

What a great story with losing their coach midway through the season, then going on to win the inaugural NCS Open championship. And when the team got together for the team championship photo after the game, someone brought a huge Fathead picture of Coach Hip that they put in the center of the photo.

 

[ankleassassin]

That's savage. The AD heated righ now.

 

[observer22]

https://www.eastbaytimes.com/2020/0...-for-north-coast-section-open-division-title/

 

[ClayK]

A question: How many minutes do you think Choice played?

Another: How many of her five foul calls were bad? How many were borderline?

 

[observer22]

A question: How many minutes do you think Choice played?

Another: How many of her five foul calls were bad? How many were borderline?

She played hard. Fouls happen. I don’t think the calls were bad (like the CN coach did), just unfortunate. I’m not going to sit here and criticize the reffing. Obviously, the CN crowd was upset and the SJ crowd was happy. The 4th was really unfortunate, when she was just hustling toward a loose ball and ended up colliding with a Pilots player. It had to be called, but wasn’t just some dumb foul. She missed several minutes of the 2nd quarter and a lot of the 4th. The article states she sat almost half the game, but I thought she played more than that. It was very noticeable when she was out though as that’s the only time St. Joe’s pressed.

 

[UncleYacht]

She played hard. Fouls happen. I don’t think the calls were bad (like the CN coach did), just unfortunate. I’m not going to sit here and criticize the reffing. Obviously, the CN crowd was upset and the SJ crowd was happy. The 4th was really unfortunate, when she was just hustling toward a loose ball and ended up colliding with a Pilots player. It had to be called, but wasn’t just some dumb foul. She missed several minutes of the 2nd quarter and a lot of the 4th. The article states she sat almost half the game, but I thought she played more than that. It was very noticeable when she was out though as that’s the only time St. Joe’s pressed.

I have heard from multiple sources that the officiating was extremely poor.

 

[observer22]

I have heard from multiple sources that the officiating was extremely poor.

I’m sure that the story in the North Bay. I don’t know that the Pilot fans felt that way. Calls during tight important games seem to always be questioned. CN had a nice lead and let it get away, which is only magnified with Choice in foul trouble.

 

[UncleYacht]

I’m sure that the story in the North Bay. I don’t know that the Pilot fans felt that way. Calls during tight important games seem to always be questioned. CN had a nice lead and let it get away, which is only magnified with Choice in foul trouble.

Most likely just fuel in the tank for a hopeful Nor Cal rematch.

 

[northbaybbguru]

Anya played maybe 14 mins...

She picked up her 2nd at about the 4:47 mark of the 1st. Sat until mid 2nd... played about a min and half and picked up 3rd and sat rest of half. Played until 4 min mark of 3rd and picked up her 4th. Sat for 9 more mins and went in and got 5th after about a min and half.

Never really had a chance to play.

1st foul was a jump ball where choice had BOTH hands on ball.
2nd foul was choice drive to basket and got hammered. Crowd thinkn 2 shots and reacted when ref called offensive..ref called her for left forearm offensive.
3rd foul hand check..ticky tak but it was a foul.
The 4th foul was a loose ball. I had a good angle in the 1st row. Anya made a straight line for ball and SJND girl came in from the side. Kids on both teams walking other way thinkn it was SJND foul and the ref called it on choice.
5th foul? Check out the Press Democrat picture...choice inside position on rebound SJND girl with elbow right across her face. Foul Choice again.... When Mitch Stephen's (sf Chronicle) and Darren Sebbeda(SJ Mercury news ) both tweet out about the fouls on Choice then you may say there were probably some head scratchers.

That being said even without Choice playing much CN had 1 pt lead with 3:47 left and proceeded to get torched on the same isolation play for 14 straight points during a 14-0 run. And CN gave up 28 in the 4th....sooooo that's just losing their defensive focus and they have no one to blame but themselves on that.

I've always said in a game if 1 ref is making all the calls usually that ref is the "bad" ref. And in this game it was pretty noticeable that 1 ref was making most of the calls against both teams.

It's a 1 game playoff and anything can and will happen... just ask PW and SMS...so when given the opportunity at a championship you need to take advantage of it cause it's not like it's a best of 3/5 or 7...There are no do overs... and coming down the stretch SJND made ALL the plays in the last 3 mins.

I thought CN did enough to win(even without choice) for 3 1/2 qtrs..but it's a 4 qtr game and SJND made the plays at the end that they had to...to win. The game flipped in a blink of an eye and that was because SJND made the plays down the stretch.

 

[northbaybbguru]

And I do think if Clovis West is brought North we could see a SJND vs CN 1st round rematch at 4/5 slot in the Norcal Open.

Otherwise if CW not brought North I could see a CN vs Salesian rematch in the 4/5 game.

I'll be curious to see where the CIF put SJND in the seedings. As I said I think NCS Open winner should be put ahead of SMS but who knows how the CIF will see it.

 

[northbaybbguru]

***I want it to be clear that I AM NOT BLAMING THE REFS for the CN loss. The question was asked about the Choice fouls so I replied.

SJND made the plays down the stretch to win the game and based on them making those plays (in crunch time) deserved to win the game.

 

[UncleYacht]

Anya played maybe 14 mins...

She picked up her 2nd at about the 4:47 mark of the 1st. Sat until mid 2nd... played about a min and half and picked up 3rd and sat rest of half. Played until 4 min mark of 3rd and picked up her 4th. Sat for 9 more mins and went in and got 5th after about a min and half.
Pretty much heard just about the
Never really had a chance to play.

1st foul was a jump ball where choice had BOTH hands on ball.
2nd foul was choice drive to basket and got hammered. Crowd thinkn 2 shots and reacted when ref called offensive..ref called her for left forearm offensive.
3rd foul hand check..ticky tak but it was a foul.
The 4th foul was a loose ball. I had a good angle in the 1st row. Anya made a straight line for ball and SJND girl came in from the side. Kids on both teams walking other way thinkn it was SJND foul and the ref called it on choice.
5th foul? Check out the Press Democrat picture...choice inside position on rebound SJND girl with elbow right across her face. Foul Choice again.... When Mitch Stephen's (sf Chronicle) and Darren Sebbeda(SJ Mercury news ) both tweet out about the fouls on Choice then you may say there were probably some head scratchers.

That being said even without Choice playing much CN had 1 pt lead with 3:47 left and proceeded to get torched on the same isolation play for 14 straight points during a 14-0 run. And CN gave up 28 in the 4th....sooooo that's just losing their defensive focus and they have no one to blame but themselves on that.

I've always said in a game if 1 ref is making all the calls usually that ref is the "bad" ref. And in this game it was pretty noticeable that 1 ref was making most of the calls against both teams.

It's a 1 game playoff and anything can and will happen... just ask PW and SMS...so when given the opportunity at a championship you need to take advantage of it cause it's not like it's a best of 3/5 or 7...There are no do overs... and coming down the stretch SJND made ALL the plays in the last 3 mins.

I thought CN did enough to win(even without choice) for 3 1/2 qtrs..but it's a 4 qtr game and SJND made the plays at the end that they had to...to win. The game flipped in a blink of an eye and that was because SJND made the plays down the stretch.

Anya played maybe 14 mins...

She picked up her 2nd at about the 4:47 mark of the 1st. Sat until mid 2nd... played about a min and half and picked up 3rd and sat rest of half. Played until 4 min mark of 3rd and picked up her 4th. Sat for 9 more mins and went in and got 5th after about a min and half.

Never really had a chance to play.

1st foul was a jump ball where choice had BOTH hands on ball.
2nd foul was choice drive to basket and got hammered. Crowd thinkn 2 shots and reacted when ref called offensive..ref called her for left forearm offensive.
3rd foul hand check..ticky tak but it was a foul.
The 4th foul was a loose ball. I had a good angle in the 1st row. Anya made a straight line for ball and SJND girl came in from the side. Kids on both teams walking other way thinkn it was SJND foul and the ref called it on choice.
5th foul? Check out the Press Democrat picture...choice inside position on rebound SJND girl with elbow right across her face. Foul Choice again.... When Mitch Stephen's (sf Chronicle) and Darren Sebbeda(SJ Mercury news ) both tweet out about the fouls on Choice then you may say there were probably some head scratchers.

That being said even without Choice playing much CN had 1 pt lead with 3:47 left and proceeded to get torched on the same isolation play for 14 straight points during a 14-0 run. And CN gave up 28 in the 4th....sooooo that's just losing their defensive focus and they have no one to blame but themselves on that.

I've always said in a game if 1 ref is making all the calls usually that ref is the "bad" ref. And in this game it was pretty noticeable that 1 ref was making most of the calls against both teams.

It's a 1 game playoff and anything can and will happen... just ask PW and SMS...so when given the opportunity at a championship you need to take advantage of it cause it's not like it's a best of 3/5 or 7...There are no do overs... and coming down the stretch SJND made ALL the plays in the last 3 mins.

I thought CN did enough to win(even without choice) for 3 1/2 qtrs..but it's a 4 qtr game and SJND made the plays at the end that they had to...to win. The game flipped in a blink of an eye and that was because SJND made the plays down the stretch.

Pretty close to the description I was given, not quite as detailed but nonetheless blown calls are tough to swallow. At least it wasn't season ending. Maybe we'll take a visit to rematchcity.com hopefully with the players deciding the outcome.

 

[DonniePeckerwood]

Rematchcity.com

@kiddman32 you like that!?

 

[straightline50]

I have heard from multiple sources that the officiating was extremely poor.

Did anyone from St. Joseph tell you that?

 

[straightline50]

Anya played maybe 14 mins...

She picked up her 2nd at about the 4:47 mark of the 1st. Sat until mid 2nd... played about a min and half and picked up 3rd and sat rest of half. Played until 4 min mark of 3rd and picked up her 4th. Sat for 9 more mins and went in and got 5th after about a min and half.

Never really had a chance to play.

1st foul was a jump ball where choice had BOTH hands on ball.
2nd foul was choice drive to basket and got hammered. Crowd thinkn 2 shots and reacted when ref called offensive..ref called her for left forearm offensive.
3rd foul hand check..ticky tak but it was a foul.
The 4th foul was a loose ball. I had a good angle in the 1st row. Anya made a straight line for ball and SJND girl came in from the side. Kids on both teams walking other way thinkn it was SJND foul and the ref called it on choice.
5th foul? Check out the Press Democrat picture...choice inside position on rebound SJND girl with elbow right across her face. Foul Choice again.... When Mitch Stephen's (sf Chronicle) and Darren Sebbeda(SJ Mercury news ) both tweet out about the fouls on Choice then you may say there were probably some head scratchers.

That being said even without Choice playing much CN had 1 pt lead with 3:47 left and proceeded to get torched on the same isolation play for 14 straight points during a 14-0 run. And CN gave up 28 in the 4th....sooooo that's just losing their defensive focus and they have no one to blame but themselves on that.

I've always said in a game if 1 ref is making all the calls usually that ref is the "bad" ref. And in this game it was pretty noticeable that 1 ref was making most of the calls against both teams.

It's a 1 game playoff and anything can and will happen... just ask PW and SMS...so when given the opportunity at a championship you need to take advantage of it cause it's not like it's a best of 3/5 or 7...There are no do overs... and coming down the stretch SJND made ALL the plays in the last 3 mins.

I thought CN did enough to win(even without choice) for 3 1/2 qtrs..but it's a 4 qtr game and SJND made the plays at the end that they had to...to win. The game flipped in a blink of an eye and that was because SJND made the plays down the stretch.

So out of the 5 fouls, you have only one being a foul and that was ticky tac at best?

 

[UncleYacht]

Did anyone from St. Joseph tell you that?

Nope, just some writers from the Chronicle and Mercury.

 

[GBBall4L]

After watching the replay on NFHS I though the traveling calls in the first half were more questionable than the fouls. Should the result of the smaller person being on th ground determine the fouls? I say not. When choice fouled out, the bigger SJND player jumped straight up for the ball and choice jumped into her. She was bigger so choice fell. If a player jumps into another player even going for the ball thats a foul. The foul in the first half in the drive, the camera was behind the play so I couldnt fully see it but I did see choice wind up her elbow on the drive and from the view of the ref they must have thought she used her elbow to nudge. I think officiating is always so much biased toward smaller people that when things like this happen we initially can think it's poor officiating. I think the girl ref was just being fair. She was probably a bigger Hooper and got bad calls against her and has an eye for those biased calls. Just my thoughts.

 

[UncleYacht]

After watching the replay on NFHS I though the traveling calls in the first half were more questionable than the fouls. Should the result of the smaller person being on th ground determine the fouls? I say not. When choice fouled out, the bigger SJND player jumped straight up for the ball and choice jumped into her. She was bigger so choice fell. It a player jumps into another player even going for the ball thats a foul. The foul in the first half in the drive, I the camera was behind the play so I couldnt fully see it but I did see choice wind up her elbow on the drive and from the view of the ref they must have thought she used her elbow to nudge. I think officiating is always so much biased toward smaller people that when things like this happen we initially can think it's poor officiating. I think the girl ref was just being fair. She was probably a bigger Hooper and got bad calls against her and has an eye for those biased calls. Just my thoughts.

I think we probably all agree that sometimes a "no call" is the right call.

 

[GBBall4L]

I think we probably all agree that sometimes a "no call" is the right call.

True but unfortunately when the players are bigger the refs only see no calls as being the right call when the small player fouls. Just because the bigger player doesn't fall or go flying doesn't mean it's not a foul. We complain about flopping but players that have size on them have to damn near win an academy award to get a call. Where as the smaller players always get the calls and the perceptions in their favor. A no call is the right call when it can be even. If it can't be called even the refs have to call it.

 

[UncleYacht]

True but unfortunately when the players are bigger the refs only see no calls as being the right call when the small player fouls. Just because the bigger player doesn't fall or go flying doesn't mean it's not a foul. We complain about flopping but players that have size on them have to damn near win an academy award to get a call. Where as the smaller players always get the calls and the perceptions in their favor. A no call is the right call when it can be even. If it can't be called even the refs have to call it.

When it's close and not clear, LET THE KIDS PLAY has always been my stance. Especially in a Title game... Hopefully these two great teams get to go up against each other again at Nor Cals. Rematchcity.com

 

[northbaybbguru]

I'm not even saying that choice should have got the calls. I would say that 3 fouls were no calls. Just let the girls play. The loose ball foul was brutal. Anya was just bigger and stronger so when they met the girl who has been in the weight room didnt move and the other bounced. With the 5th foul..it should have jut been a play on IMO.

 

[GBBall4L]

When it's close and not clear, LET THE KIDS PLAY has always been my stance. Especially in a Title game... Hopefully these two great teams get to go up against each other again at Nor Cals. Rematchcity.com

It will be a great rematch. I do believe Choice fouling out impacted the game and if she doesn't foul the result would have been closer. I hope they run into each other in State.

 

[Bigran44]

I’ve watched a few Cardinal Newman games and choice is often in foul trouble. They rely heavily on her on both ends. They also predominantly play man which is always risky. She basically is in every play every possession on both ends and has a great motor.

 

[kiddman32]

Bottom line is, once Choice fouled out with CN still in the lead (IIRC), the Pilots smelled the blood in the water and flat took the game over.

I didn’t think the calls were egregious, tho a couple may have been questionable... In any case, it’s up to the player (and her coach) to recognize the situation and adjust.

 

[GBBall4L]

Bottom line is, once Choice fouled out with CN still in the lead (IIRC), the Pilots smelled the blood in the water and flat took the game over.

I didn’t think the calls were egregious, tho a couple may have been questionable... In any case, it’s up to the player (and her coach) to recognize the situation and adjust.

I agree. I hate to see the refs influence the outcome on nuance calls.