Top high school players?
- Thread starter ClayK
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Channel Stuart ( Brookside Christian) she is playing out of position right now. She plays the 4 but is a great 2 guard. She brings the ball up instead of the 1 and 2 guards on she team. She has handles to breaker the press. She also one of the best man defenders because she is very physical and head Toughness which you need at the next level.
Kendall Weary (Lincoln of Stockton) one of the quickest first step guards around. During the summer played against Ariel Johnson and Neenah Young. She is problem one of the best 1 on 1 defender in the class of 2018. She is like having a track star on the floor with her speed. She is also strong and physical.
Kendall Weary (Lincoln of Stockton) one of the quickest first step guards around. During the summer played against Ariel Johnson and Neenah Young. She is problem one of the best 1 on 1 defender in the class of 2018. She is like having a track star on the floor with her speed. She is also strong and physical.
Really like that soph point forward at Aptos, Gabby Giuffre. Selfless. Slick. Tough. Focused. Smart. Very nice prospect.
Ok I'll try at this. I would consider this a local and regional list. No specific order alphabetical
PG Ariel Johnson, Claire Steele, Ryanne Walters
SG Hannah Jump, Karisma Ortiz, Neanah Young
SF McKenzie Forbes, Hailey Jones, Hailey Van Dyke
PF Aquira Acosta, Kassidy De Lapp , Amaya Oliver
C Ali Bamberger, Shayley Harris, Angel Jackson
PG Ariel Johnson, Claire Steele, Ryanne Walters
SG Hannah Jump, Karisma Ortiz, Neanah Young
SF McKenzie Forbes, Hailey Jones, Hailey Van Dyke
PF Aquira Acosta, Kassidy De Lapp , Amaya Oliver
C Ali Bamberger, Shayley Harris, Angel Jackson
I think a lot you are off subject!!! Clay asked about players that aren't on the radar that should be ??
But the list is good but Peant is Probly one of the strongest PF in Norcal. Oliver is not a true PF but more like a 3 or SF.
But the list is good but Peant is Probly one of the strongest PF in Norcal. Oliver is not a true PF but more like a 3 or SF.
McClatchy has Turney.and plus they have a great 2 underclassman Lowery and Hall. That's why they will be ranked high and do well. .
Antelope will be good this but there will goes as far as Spann tales them.
Antelope will be good this but there will goes as far as Spann tales them.
Actually, I'm happy to have both the well-known names and the under-the-radar types.
Top 10 2018 in my opinion!!!
FIRST TEAM
PG Ariel Johnson (SMS)
SG Neenah Young (SMS)
SF Hailey Jones (MITTY)
PF Sirena Tuitele ( Pleasant Valley)
C DeCossta (SMS)
Second
PG Lea Anderson (Davis Modesto)
SG Karisma Ortiz (Mitty)
SF Hailey Van Dyke ( Campolindo)
PF Kassidy De Lapp ( Oak Ridge)
C Angle Jackson ( Salesian)
That's is my opinion !!!! In know going to question some of my picks and positions changes.
1) Sirena Tuitele out right best PF. Just haven't been notice because of the school she plays for. She will Dominate any Power Foward in Norcal.
2) DeCosta as the Center on first team because I would run the Trangle 2 which needs PG, 2 wings and 2 PF. DeCosta is just DeCosta best player in the Nation 2018)
3) No Super stand out Center this year.
4) Lea Anderson Probly one of best Deffence guards in Norcal. I would take a bet 1 on 1 Anderson Vs any PG . The only thing she is lacking is size.
5) Angel Jackson up coming center. She can score and block shots. What she is lacking strength and footwork but has 2 year to Develop. She will be at the top of she class next year.
FIRST TEAM
PG Ariel Johnson (SMS)
SG Neenah Young (SMS)
SF Hailey Jones (MITTY)
PF Sirena Tuitele ( Pleasant Valley)
C DeCossta (SMS)
Second
PG Lea Anderson (Davis Modesto)
SG Karisma Ortiz (Mitty)
SF Hailey Van Dyke ( Campolindo)
PF Kassidy De Lapp ( Oak Ridge)
C Angle Jackson ( Salesian)
That's is my opinion !!!! In know going to question some of my picks and positions changes.
1) Sirena Tuitele out right best PF. Just haven't been notice because of the school she plays for. She will Dominate any Power Foward in Norcal.
2) DeCosta as the Center on first team because I would run the Trangle 2 which needs PG, 2 wings and 2 PF. DeCosta is just DeCosta best player in the Nation 2018)
3) No Super stand out Center this year.
4) Lea Anderson Probly one of best Deffence guards in Norcal. I would take a bet 1 on 1 Anderson Vs any PG . The only thing she is lacking is size.
5) Angel Jackson up coming center. She can score and block shots. What she is lacking strength and footwork but has 2 year to Develop. She will be at the top of she class next year.
Forbes is good but I look for great 2 way players that are very physical light the next level!! That's just my opinion.
NIA Lowery 2019 is the Best Player that has not been mentioned for clarification. She has Turney as well and other underclassmen as a great supporting cast.
Respect: u say u look at 2 Way players which is why u didn't mention Mackenzie Forbes. BUT u only mentioned Lea Anderson on the defensive end. I agree she is awesome on defense and i love Lea but in the real world everyone is going to take forbes over lea. Ryanne Walters/SAC is right behind A. Johnson as best point guards in the area.
Respect: u say u look at 2 Way players which is why u didn't mention Mackenzie Forbes. BUT u only mentioned Lea Anderson on the defensive end. I agree she is awesome on defense and i love Lea but in the real world everyone is going to take forbes over lea. Ryanne Walters/SAC is right behind A. Johnson as best point guards in the area.
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CoachDviks
Lea Anderson is a great Defender and great Facilitator with her great vision. She scores a lot too because all of her steals. The girls you mention are all great scores but don't put the same Energy into their Defense.
'CW Golden Eagle
I know they are from different class but I was talk over all this year 2018.
This is for all that don't know about college women's basketball. If you don't play defense you won't get on the court. Why do you think a lot these high school girl disappear in college or end up coming home? It's most because the don't play defense because in college everyone can score!!!!!
Lea Anderson is a great Defender and great Facilitator with her great vision. She scores a lot too because all of her steals. The girls you mention are all great scores but don't put the same Energy into their Defense.
'CW Golden Eagle
I know they are from different class but I was talk over all this year 2018.
This is for all that don't know about college women's basketball. If you don't play defense you won't get on the court. Why do you think a lot these high school girl disappear in college or end up coming home? It's most because the don't play defense because in college everyone can score!!!!!
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And can we please finally recognize what kind of defensive systems these kids play in high school... Not one good team in college plays a steady dose of trapping.. kids need to learn how to play man...
On another note, I would list Karisma Ortiz as a PG and put her on the top/ first team.. but thats my opinion
Full-court pressure and halfcourt traps fade as the level of play rises, because all you need to break down either one is a ballhandler who can dribble through a double-team. It's hard to find that at the high school/club level, but almost every D1 college team has one or two kids who can do so, especially on a bigger court.
How many presses/double teams did you see in the WNBA this summer? (Oh, that's right -- no one watches.)
How many presses/double teams did you see in the NCAA playoffs, or during the NCAA regular season?
Of course, the object of the game is to win, and if presses/traps can win for a high school team, we'll continue to see them. But OnBall8 is right -- a successful college player must be able to play man-to-man defense at some level of efficiency or she will not find the court.
How many presses/double teams did you see in the WNBA this summer? (Oh, that's right -- no one watches.)
How many presses/double teams did you see in the NCAA playoffs, or during the NCAA regular season?
Of course, the object of the game is to win, and if presses/traps can win for a high school team, we'll continue to see them. But OnBall8 is right -- a successful college player must be able to play man-to-man defense at some level of efficiency or she will not find the court.
There is truth about needing to defend, obviously. But with that being said, do you think college coaches would rather have an elite offensive player with marginal defensive skill or an elite defender with marginal offensive skill? In my 24 years of coaching, I continue to watch the elite offensive players getting recruited over the elite defensive. Forget trapping presses, how many college teams apply full court man to man pressure? But how many college teams play zone or pack line D? High bball IQ, length, understanding defensive principles/rotations and adequate defensive abilities can allow a player to survive at the next level. To me, it is far harder to teach a kid to put the ball in the basket that can't score than to get a player to be at least decent defensively. It is also easier to hide a subpar defender than to hide a poor offensive player. Geno always says, "I recruit scorers. I can teach them to defend." Both are needed, no question. But if you can't play a lick on the offensive end, you won't get off the bench either.
OnBall8
I taught about I just think Young is just a little be more aggressive then Ortiz. I seen them both play Young just has more nasty play that you see a lot at the next level.
CW Golden Eagles
I agree to a point but I seen many scores get recruit then end up back home and transfer because their defense wasn't up to pair. Yes to get a Scholarship a player needs to score but can a score still have them same legs in the 4 quarter if they go all out on the defense side.
The Biggest thing to in high school basketball how many coach man to man defense? With that said coaching is the main problem why some player don't play man to man. I know a few that coach great man to man defense. Just to name a few Pico and Sue. Pico hands down the best Man to Man defense coach.
These are a few resent players from Norcal that both play offence and defense very well.
Both Moore's (Salesian now plays for USC)
McDonald (Brookside went UW now plays for Arizona)
Cayton (SMS now plays for Cal)
Thomas ( BOD now plays for Cal)
Ionescu (MM now plays for Oregon)
Green (SMS went to Cal now plays for LMU)
I taught about I just think Young is just a little be more aggressive then Ortiz. I seen them both play Young just has more nasty play that you see a lot at the next level.
CW Golden Eagles
I agree to a point but I seen many scores get recruit then end up back home and transfer because their defense wasn't up to pair. Yes to get a Scholarship a player needs to score but can a score still have them same legs in the 4 quarter if they go all out on the defense side.
The Biggest thing to in high school basketball how many coach man to man defense? With that said coaching is the main problem why some player don't play man to man. I know a few that coach great man to man defense. Just to name a few Pico and Sue. Pico hands down the best Man to Man defense coach.
These are a few resent players from Norcal that both play offence and defense very well.
Both Moore's (Salesian now plays for USC)
McDonald (Brookside went UW now plays for Arizona)
Cayton (SMS now plays for Cal)
Thomas ( BOD now plays for Cal)
Ionescu (MM now plays for Oregon)
Green (SMS went to Cal now plays for LMU)
I think that goes without saying. Everyone knows colleges will recruit the scorer and teach them how to play defense. It doesn't take 24 years of coaching to figure that one out. That's not at all the point I was trying to make. But imagine all these "scorers" getting recruited out of run n gun trapping systems that can not immediately step into a college program and be effective. Will they eventually learn? maybe, probably, who knows. But it is a fact that there are plenty of kids on the lists above that are extremely talented, and are elite high school players, and could not step foot on the court with a college team as is.
I'm sure you've seen it tons of time Craig, kids come in from 8th grade, one has been coached better (maybe by you), knows the system, but is limited physically. Then another kid has better athleticism, better knack for scoring, higher talent ceiling, etc but has never been taught how to play within a system. Probably not hard for you to figure out which one will be better in the long term once they learn a little, but I'm sure you think to yourself "man, imagine if her previous coach already taught her this". Now why wouldn't this be the same thing for college coaches?
I'm sure you've seen it tons of time Craig, kids come in from 8th grade, one has been coached better (maybe by you), knows the system, but is limited physically. Then another kid has better athleticism, better knack for scoring, higher talent ceiling, etc but has never been taught how to play within a system. Probably not hard for you to figure out which one will be better in the long term once they learn a little, but I'm sure you think to yourself "man, imagine if her previous coach already taught her this". Now why wouldn't this be the same thing for college coaches?
I get your opinion and I'm not arguing that part of it, but why does that leave Ortiz to be a shooting guard? She is a better PG than anderson on the second team. I think she should be considered against Johnson
Ya I agree. Need to do both. I think it's important that coaches prepare their players for ALL defenses, regardless of what you run. We prefer to be a pressing and trapping team. However, we spend more time on our man to man defense every day in practice than we do our press. We played a lot of man in the second half of games last year and we played man the entire game against Mitty in the state championship, played a lot of man against Troy and LB Poly. Coaches do their players a disservice if you only teach one style of defense in practice.
OnBall8
Look at first team almost all can play PG. Johnson and Ortiz is Interchangeable which the will be I college too.
Look at first team almost all can play PG. Johnson and Ortiz is Interchangeable which the will be I college too.
Young and Ortiz are two different types of players.
Young is much more physically imposing and primarily looks to score when she has the ball. The St Marys style is much more aggressive with constant pressure throughout the game.
Ortiz is more of the coach on the floor, facilitator. Given the program she plays in, she's probably asked to do and absorb numerous offensive schemes and change those throughout the game constantly. She is definitely looks to pass first rather than score.
I know we have some top high school coaches that read the posts on this site and maybe they can comment on this. But in my opinion, times have really changed in regards to what coaches are teaching and stressing. The game has really changed because of AAU. OFFENSE is the name of the game now. Those players that do the dirty work, play tough DEFENSE, and make all those hustle plays that don't show up in the box score are often overlooked and under-appreciated nowadays. Coaches all say they want players that play hard nosed defense, but I just don't see it anymore. When it comes down to it, those players are sitting on the bench and coaches want girls that are able to put the ball in the basket. As Coach Craig mentioned, Geno recruits scorers. The game is about one on one training now. Find the most athletic talents and teach/train them ball handling one on one moves to the basket. AAU coaches don't teach any team defense, nor team play. It is about who is most athletic and can take their players one on one to the basket to draw the defense. Then have a couple 3 point shooters on the perimeter to knock down open shots. College recruiters looking for the same thing. At least the girls high school teams will play some team ball, I cant even watch the boys anymore because it is so much one on one. Everyone doing zone trapping defenses, not many teaching good ole man-to-man hard nosed in your face defensive principles like the old days.
I don't think it's changed because since Naismith and his peach basket, the team that won was the team that put the ball in the peach basket the most -- and thus, by definition, that's the most important skill.
What I do think has changed is due more to parents than club ball, and it's the emphasis on winning every single tournament from sixth grade on. That means the elite players a) are encouraged to score, score and score some more, and b) get to the rim over and over again because that's what's best this weekend, not what's best for their game.
And the whole pressing/trapping thing was glorified by Macolm Gladwell in his clueless piece on Vivek Ranadive, the owner of the Kings, about how Ranadive won games by using athletes to press and trap rather than acquire skills. If winning is the only thing, then Gladwell (and Trump) and Ranadive are right on the money, but if there's more to it than that, all are missing part of the picture. And maybe a big part.
What I do think has changed is due more to parents than club ball, and it's the emphasis on winning every single tournament from sixth grade on. That means the elite players a) are encouraged to score, score and score some more, and b) get to the rim over and over again because that's what's best this weekend, not what's best for their game.
And the whole pressing/trapping thing was glorified by Macolm Gladwell in his clueless piece on Vivek Ranadive, the owner of the Kings, about how Ranadive won games by using athletes to press and trap rather than acquire skills. If winning is the only thing, then Gladwell (and Trump) and Ranadive are right on the money, but if there's more to it than that, all are missing part of the picture. And maybe a big part.
basketba11..
I am a HS coach. I was on the boys side for a long time and recently started with girls. I was 100% against zones. But as I have learned on the girls side at the high school level. Man to Man is not as crucial as it is on the boys side or probably at the girls collegiate level. Instead you must be able to break a press/trap, Shoot the ball well and have some type of big that can control the paint. I have had to adapt because I stressed the importance of man to man but what i have learned is majority teams/coaches will just sit in a zone because girls are just not as good/strong passes to find holes in the defense and they are not strong and quick enough to get up 3's from as deep and as fast which limits them to be very effective vs the zone...
now if your craig or tom with SHOOTERS everywhere they dont have that problem lol.
*Just my take on the recent conversation post.
I am a HS coach. I was on the boys side for a long time and recently started with girls. I was 100% against zones. But as I have learned on the girls side at the high school level. Man to Man is not as crucial as it is on the boys side or probably at the girls collegiate level. Instead you must be able to break a press/trap, Shoot the ball well and have some type of big that can control the paint. I have had to adapt because I stressed the importance of man to man but what i have learned is majority teams/coaches will just sit in a zone because girls are just not as good/strong passes to find holes in the defense and they are not strong and quick enough to get up 3's from as deep and as fast which limits them to be very effective vs the zone...
now if your craig or tom with SHOOTERS everywhere they dont have that problem lol.
*Just my take on the recent conversation post.
Shooters, however, can be developed, but you have to start in middle school. There is no reason that a reasonably athletic girl cannot make 25% of her threes if her feet are set and she has a good look. But girls must be coaxed into shooting, forced to practice it, and forced to shoot open threes in a game.
Once you do that, the threes will fall, and the zones no longer work.
It takes time, and lots of missed threes, but once you force teams out of their zones and make them defend the pick-and-roll, your offense will hum, regardless of size. (In fact, a small team can get that big out of the paint by making threes, forcing the switch to man-to-man, and then have the big's player set up beyond the arc.)
And by the way, a 25% rate on threes converts to a 37.5% shooting percentage from inside the arc, and very, very few girls' teams shoot 37.5%.
Once you do that, the threes will fall, and the zones no longer work.
It takes time, and lots of missed threes, but once you force teams out of their zones and make them defend the pick-and-roll, your offense will hum, regardless of size. (In fact, a small team can get that big out of the paint by making threes, forcing the switch to man-to-man, and then have the big's player set up beyond the arc.)
And by the way, a 25% rate on threes converts to a 37.5% shooting percentage from inside the arc, and very, very few girls' teams shoot 37.5%.
The Biggest thing is different people look at the game different from others. What missing from the high school game to compare from before is quality coaches but that not there fault it's the coach that taught them????
I totally agree that threes have revolutionized girls' basketball. and would advise any young player to develop that weapon. but, as Mark Twain said, there are three kinds of Lies--Lies, Damn Lies, and Statistics.
for example, that team whose 3-point shooters hit 25% and whose overall shooting was 37.4% actually hit more than 37.4% inside the arc, possibly a lot more if a lot of 3's were taken. even though you can calculate non-three-point % if you have complete stats (not just the boxscore), that wouldn't even take account of foul production. very few 3 shooters get fouled in the act (coaches and fans tear out their hair on such a foul) while shooting fouls are much more common inside the arc. most teams shoot better than 50% from the line, and a shot that produces a defensive foul should be counted as a shot attempt, with greater than a 50% conversion rate. I'd guess a shooting foul is instead counted as a non-shot, with free throws tracked separately. and beyond points, a shooting foul on the defense creates dividends for the offensive team down the line--earlier bonus and/or foul out of opponents. a simple % comparison is misleading. since overall % is depressed by those missed 3's and shots that produce points (shooting fouls) do not elevate overall %.
and I love watching kids confidently shoot the three when they're open.
mkbgdns
IF players knew how to play man to man defense there won't be so many 3's being put up. Player would be ran off the 3 point line and the skip pass for 3 won't be there either.
All the greats play both defense and offence.
Kobe Bryant
Larry Bird
MJ
Magic Johnson
Robert Parish
Chris Mullins
James Worthy
and the list goes on.
Yes today NBA players score A lot because no one plays defense until the end of the game!!
Most of the players I mention won defense awards.
IF players knew how to play man to man defense there won't be so many 3's being put up. Player would be ran off the 3 point line and the skip pass for 3 won't be there either.
All the greats play both defense and offence.
Kobe Bryant
Larry Bird
MJ
Magic Johnson
Robert Parish
Chris Mullins
James Worthy
and the list goes on.
Yes today NBA players score A lot because no one plays defense until the end of the game!!
Most of the players I mention won defense awards.
i get what all of you are saying and I'm not saying you are wrong. My original point was not in regards to the girls high school game as a whole, or even in regards to the average player. Most girls are average players at best (same with coaches too actually) and therefore teams will do what they have to in order to win games. Sometimes that involves pressing, trapping, playing zone, etc. Thats all good and well. My point is that there are many elite, nationally recruited players that are not as ready as they can be. I've talked to USA bball coaches, and college coaches that are thoroughly surprised when some of these kids don't know the basics of how to guard someone, especially off the ball. Helpside, vision, etc isn't even in their vocabulary. And I think THAT is a disservice. And this isnt directed at everyone, as Craig said, he does practice man-to-man principles everyday whether it is implemented in the next games gameplan or not. At least those girls have been exposed to it. Not to pick on SMS again, but they are my prime example of the contrary. I can't stand to watch them play half court man. Are they the only ones guilty of this? of course not, just an easy example. In my opinion, I think there are more kids that should be more college ready but aren't due to ineptitude on the defensive side of the ball.
One of the very best examples of a program that emphasizes solid man principles, especially in the halfcourt, combined with outstanding three-point shooting, is tiny Pinewood. And they have excellent players to start with. That's a very tough package to handle if you have to play them.
Onball , obviously u haven't followed girls basketball. Green did not play for SMS. Also, SMS has had more d-1 players than any school in California in the last 15 years and most of them started as frosh . Ask any college coach and they would take a SMS player if they can get them . When you have the best press-in the country and one of the most successful programs in the country , maybe you should do you're homework.
It was Respect that posted about Green and SMS, but it obviously was a typo and meant to say SMB.
Green (SMS went to Cal now plays for LMU)
