Very Early Look at the CIF Bowl Divisions - 2024

[Cal 14]

As it is now playoff season for nearly all CIF sections, it may be time to take a very early look at the potential CIF bowl divisions (for those interested).

As in years past, I will not be making any predictions regarding who might win which division. Rather all of the teams listed are the remaining highest seeds in their respective brackets. For the Oakland and San Francisco sections, the teams listed are those assumed to be the top seeds when they are finally published.

Because the list will be long, my commentary will be in a response to the initial post.


Open Division (Section Division, Calpreps ratings)

North: De La Salle (NCS Open, 67.0) vs. South: Mater Dei (SS D-I, 102.6)

D-1AA

North: Folsom (SJS D-1, 59.3) vs. Clovis East (CS D-IAA, 58.3)

South: Lincoln (SDS Open, 60.5) vs. Murrieta Valley (SS D-2, 58.1)

D-1A

North: Pittsburg (NCS D-1, 52.2) vs. St. Ignatius (CCS Open, 42.4)

South: Simi Valley (SS D-3, 46.1) vs. San Marcos (SDS D-I, 39.3)

D-2AA

North: St. Francis (CCS D-I, 43.1) vs. Rocklin (SJS D-2, 42.2)

South: St. Bonaventure (SS D-4, 39) vs. Bakersfield Christian (CS D-II, 29.9)

D-2A

North: Twelve Bridges (SJS D-4, 36.7) vs. Wilcox (CCS D-II, 29.0)

South: Bakersfield (CS D-IA, 29.4) vs. Huntington Beach (SS D-5, 29.8)

D-3AA

North: Bradshaw Christian (SJS D-6, 29.2) vs. Oakdale (SJS D-3, 27.1)

South: Narbonne (LACS Open, 25.1) vs. Muir (SS D-6, 23.3)

D-3A

North: Liberty (NCS D-2, 23.1) vs. Hughson (SJS D-5, 22.5)

South: University City (SDS D-II, 19.1) vs. Porterville (CS D-II, 14.0)

D-4AA

North: Pleasant Valley (NS D-2, 21.7) vs. Carmel (CCS D-III, 16.3)

South: West Torrance (SS D-7, 13.3) vs. Shafter (CS D-IV, 13.3)

D-4A

North: Acalanes (NCS D-3, 16.1) vs. McClymonds (OS, 14.7)

South: Highland (SS D-9, 11.4) vs. Beckman (SS D-8, 9.0)

D-5AA

North: St. Vincent de Paul (NCS D-5, 15.4) vs. Lassen (NS D-3, 10.0)

South: St. Anthony (SS D-10, 4.9) vs. Central (SDS D-III, 4.1)

D-5A

North: Ukiah (NCS D-4, 9.0) vs. Winters (NS D-4, 7.0)

South: Bishop Union (CS D-V, -1.5) vs. Los Amigos (SS D-11, -2.8)

D-6AA

North: Arcata (NCS D-6, 5.6) vs. Summerville (SJS D-7, 5.3)

South: Ramona (SDS D-IV, -4.9) vs. Mary Star of the Sea (SS D-12, -6.3)

D-6A

North: Moreau Catholic (NCS D-7, 1.3) vs. Piedmont Hills (CCS D-IV, 0.0)

South: Eagle Rock (LACS D-I, -7.9) vs. Gahr (SS D-13, -16.3)

D-7AA

North: Lincoln (SFS, -8.7) vs. South San Francisco (CCS D-IV, -10.7)

South: Vista (SDS D-V, -20.5) vs. Arleta (LACS D-II, -23.0)

D-7A

North: Minarets (CS D-VI, -16.9) vs. Biggs (NS, -22.1)

South: Nordhoff (SS D-14, -35.4) vs. Taft (LACS D-III, -35.9)

 

[Cal 14]

There are a number of interesting story lines and we could see politics play a bigger role than normal this year.

North:

1. What to do about Folsom? Their early season loss to Serra could put them behind either/both St. Ignatius or St. Francis due to those teams' wins over the Padres. I don't suspect that the CCS Open winner would be placed in D-1AA, but you could see Pittsburg moved up and the Bulldogs placed in D-1A.

2. SJS lack of competitive playoff equity on full display, now looks like a significant outlier. Any push by the selection for divisional integrity may fall on deaf ears with Twelve Bridges (D-4) and Bradshaw Christian (D-6) rated higher than Oakdale (D-3).

3. What to do about McClymonds? The CIF voters have steadily moved the Warriors to higher divisions until they pretty much settled on having them be in D-2A. This year, however, has not been a typical year for the Oakland team. Would the committee be willing to drop them all the way down to D-4A?

4. What to do about Clovis East? As was the case last year, numerically, it would make more sense to place the CS D-IAA winner in the south, as not doing so places a heavy advantage for the north in all divisions lower than D-1AA. Placing them in the south creates more parity down the list. I doubt the committee has learned its lesson and will probably keep this division in the north.

South:

1. There seems to be more of a drop-off in ratings in the SS than last year. This could lead to a greater advantage for the north, particularly if the CS D-IAA winner remains absent from the south bracket.

2. What to do about the Bakersfield schools? I'm guessing the CS may do some politicking to make sure their D-IA winner is in a higher bracket than the D-II team. I'm also guessing that the ratings could reverse in order with the IA bracket being tougher overall. Did not notice that these two were in the same league, won by Bakersfield Christian. Swapping them in the list.

3. Retaining intersectional play. In the past, the SS seems to have lobbied to keep their teams from having to eliminate each other in the regional round. This year, they may mostly get this wish granted as the ratings do seem to fall in-line for this to happen. In only one division did there not really seem to be a choice but to have two SS teams face each other.

4. It remains remarkable how low the LACS teams need to be placed among the state brackets. Much of this has to do with the fact that just about everyone and their mothers gets to advance to the playoffs, but as I've noted in previous posts, the section just isn't good at all.

Overall:

1. If all of the section winners elect to participate in the CIF bowl games, we will have complete brackets in both the north and the south. It was not uncommon in years past to have a team have a bye in the regional round.

2. I have five of the seven Central Section teams competing in the south. In addition to the need for more moderately-rated teams in that region, it also balances out and completes the brackets in both regions.

 

[NorCalSportsFan]

Thanks for the early view.

 

[larry legend33]

Talk about watered down. Some really average teams getting a shot at the trophy while some really good teams will be done. Who would have thought Cronin at Ukiah might get another state champ and they aren't in a league champ in a pretty bad league. Cardinal Newman and MC should be playing well into December.
I've been saying it all year. Folsom loss to Serra ended their season. They will not be challenged from this point on. Hell they haven't been challenged all year. Clovis East will get pummeled.

 

[Cal 14]

 

[bulldogmgc]

CalHiSports projections:

CIF Regional Bowl Game Projections

Sorry, but last week's medium/small school rankings really have to be the last ones until the final rankings when the season is over. Instead, now that every

www.calhisports.com

 

[larry legend33]

CalHiSports projections:

CIF Regional Bowl Game Projections

Sorry, but last week's medium/small school rankings really have to be the last ones until the final rankings when the season is over. Instead, now that every

www.calhisports.com

Good stuff. They usually aren't far off at this point. I haven't seen Pitt play this year but wondering if they can do the unthinkable and knock out DLS? That would be the only option for Folsom to get into the open and even that wouldn't be guaranteed because Pitt's only loss would be to SJB.

 

[observer22]

Good stuff. They usually aren't far off at this point. I haven't seen Pitt play this year but wondering if they can do the unthinkable and knock out DLS? That would be the only option for Folsom to get into the open and even that wouldn't be guaranteed because Pitt's only loss would be to SJB.

Yeah I think if Pitt were to beat DLS, they would be the Open rep. DLS would then drop down to a lower bowl division, unless CN knocks them off!

 

[Macallan]

I think the winner of the NCS Open represents the North in the State Open game. IMO, it is DLS's to lose and if Pitt beats DLS, then Pitt goes.

 

[larry legend33]

Yeah I think if Pitt were to beat DLS, they would be the Open rep. DLS would then drop down to a lower bowl division, unless CN knocks them off!

Ironically CN stopped the original streak that DLS had back prior to the one that started in 1992. And in 1991 Newman lost in the 3A semi's to Pittsburg who then went on to beat DLS at the Oak Coliseum the next weekend. You never know..... But we got MC first and those bastards are good.

I don't disagree on the open winner. I do think there would be a lot more hype with Folsom and their 5 star QB playing against MD.

 

[Macallan]

Ironically CN stopped the original streak that DLS had back prior to the one that started in 1992. And in 1991 Newman lost in the 3A semi's to Pittsburg who then went on to beat DLS at the Oak Coliseum the next weekend. You never know..... But we got MC first and those bastards are good.

I don't disagree on the open winner. I do think there would be a lot more hype with Folsom and their 5 star QB playing against MD.

You could be correct on that. However, IMO, since Serra beat Folsom, and then went on to lay an egg in the WCAL section, there is no scenario in which Folsom can get to the open.

 

[FBAddict]

You could be correct on that. However, IMO, since Serra beat Folsom, and then went on to lay an egg in the WCAL section, there is no scenario in which Folsom can get to the open.

That is probably correct that Folsom won't be considered for Open unless at least 2 or 3 teams ahead of them loses. DLS is not expected to lose to Pittsburg, but if they did, NorCal Open would be up for grabs between Clovis East and Pittsburg with the likely nod going to undefeated Clovis East.

I think Folsom has fairly good shot if Clovis East loses to Central, Pittsburg beats DLS and then loses to SRV. In that case it would be a toss up between SRV and Folsom with the nod going to Folsom. I doubt a SF victory over SI would get SF into the discussion.

 

[PALFan]

You could be correct on that. However, IMO, since Serra beat Folsom, and then went on to lay an egg in the WCAL section, there is no scenario in which Folsom can get to the open.

Does Folsom get bumped all the way down to Div. 2A or 2AA? You have DLS that will be in the Open. Pitt is up next and then St. Francis, SI and Riordan all beat Serra and played tougher schedules then Folsom.

 

[larry legend33]

Does Folsom get bumped all the way down to Div. 2A or 2AA? You have DLS that will be in the Open. Pitt is up next and then St. Francis, SI and Riordan all beat Serra and played tougher schedules then Folsom.

I don't think so. I think the harder decision will be if both Folsom and Pitt run the table does the OPEN go to Folsom.? That seems crazy because on paper it should go to Pitt but stranger things have happened. You could argue Folsom today would be a more formidable opponent at full strength than Pitt would be. Folsom was without several key transfers during that time they lost to Serra. I'm not making excuses because fact remains they still lost but I think this is what will get pitched.

But I don't see any WCAL team remaining a candidate.

 

[observer22]

I think Folsom has fairly good shot if Clovis East loses to Central, Pittsburg beats DLS and then loses to SRV. In that case it would be a toss up between SRV and Folsom with the nod going to Folsom.

If Pittsburg beats DLS in the NCS Open final, they would almost assuredly get the Open nod. They do not then play SRV or CN. The NCS Open loser plays the SRV- CN winner for the NCS D1 crown.

 

[larry legend33]

If Pittsburg beats DLS in the NCS Open final, they would almost assuredly get the Open nod. They do not then play SRV or CN. The NCS Open loser plays the SRV- CN winner for the NCS D1 crown.

CN has to beat SRV and the loser of the Pitt/DLS game to advance to norcal correct? That is just insane. The Newman vs MC game was better than 90% of the bowl games/teams will be and that was a 1st round section game. What a joke.

I also think if Pitt wins they go but Folsom is ranked higher in virtually every poll.

 

[NorCalSportsFan]

CN and MC were in the same situation teams like Palma was in in CCS until they fixed it (partially), but even Palma could get pulled into the Open division with the current power point system since it competes in an A league. I use Palma as example because they are comparable programs and even faced off with CN a number of years. SRV is pretty strong this year, but in any given year it is no stronger than a WCAL top team which a team like Palma had to go through and when enrollment size dropped made it even harder to compete. DLS is the unique case but in the last few years even WCAL teams have had some success against them. NCS probably should incorporate equity league ratings like CCS (A, B an C) and keep A league teams in top divisions and power ratings. CCS also allows its Open/D1 league to let at least get into running for two division titles (Open and D1 titles). That way the team that loses to a team like DLS still has a playoff shot. There are still teams in this system that are on the short end if they lose round 1 in Open / D1 playoff, but it's better than one super team always eliminating all the others.

 

[bella123]

Ironically CN stopped the original streak that DLS had back prior to the one that started in 1992. And in 1991 Newman lost in the 3A semi's to Pittsburg who then went on to beat DLS at the Oak Coliseum the next weekend. You never know..... But we got MC first and those bastards are good.

Put the bottle down Larry 🤣, usually you are right on, but not on this one.

The original original streak for De La Salle reached 44 games and was broken at the Coliseum in the 87 NCS final by Monte Vista 14-13. The year before De La Salle had moved up to 3A and beat Monte Vista 24 to 7.

The ‘87 game had trick plays, bench clearing fight and came down to the wire on a controversial two point conversion attempt Rob Forrester was “stopped” by Steve Abrams at the pylon (personally think je was in). At the time De La Salle was chasing Cardinal Newman’s win streak which was 47 and at the time was a state record (ended by San Marin in ‘77 or ‘78).

DLS and Newman did play for the 2A title at the Coliseum in ‘84 . Vice and Vaez led Newman and Panella DLS. DLS beat them like 38-20.

 

[FBAddict]

If Pittsburg beats DLS in the NCS Open final, they would almost assuredly get the Open nod. They do not then play SRV or CN. The NCS Open loser plays the SRV- CN winner for the NCS D1 crown.

Good point - one which I overlooked.

 

[Cal 14]

I don't think Folsom drops all the way to 2AA. I think 1A is the lowest they'd fall, particularly if Saint Francis wins the CCS Open. That would mean two losses by St. Ignatius to the Lancers and one to San Ramon Valley. That would overcome the one loss to Serra.

 

[Cal 14]

CN has to beat SRV and the loser of the Pitt/DLS game to advance to norcal correct? That is just insane. The Newman vs MC game was better than 90% of the bowl games/teams will be and that was a 1st round section game. What a joke.

I also think if Pitt wins they go but Folsom is ranked higher in virtually every poll.

You keep going on and on about this. The point isn't to advance the top 7 teams out of the NCS and top 6 out of the CCS. The point is to advance teams out of the different levels of play. Seriously, you don't want the entire Trinity League advancing to state regional games, so you don't get the same in the NCS.

The NCS private schools have been coddled for far too long (maybe not the teams, but certainly the fans).

 

[1tunz1]

You keep going on and on about this. The point isn't to advance the top 7 teams out of the NCS and top 6 out of the CCS. The point is to advance teams out of the different levels of play. Seriously, you don't want the entire Trinity League advancing to state regional games, so you don't get the same in the NCS.

The NCS private schools have been coddled for far too long (maybe not the teams, but certainly the fans).

How would you say the ncs privates have been coddled? And how would you divide teams into different levels of play?

 

[Cal 14]

How would you say the ncs privates have been coddled? And how would you divide teams into different levels of play?

In no other CIF section would CN and MC be playing D4. At lowest, they'd be D2. The fact they've been allowed to beat up on small public schools for so long is amazing.

Look at similar-sized private schools in other sections. Palma is in CCS D2 (they were in D1 in 2022). Menlo is in CCS D2. Central Catholic is... er, was in SJS D1. St. Mary's is in SJS D2.

There really is no question that both CN and MC were among the top 8 teams in the NCS this year. Even if you did something similar to the CCS or SJS and made a declaration of the RE-A league, not much would change. It was the 2nd best league in the NCS this year. Why would anyone not expect them to be in the top division?

Larry was remarking on how close their game was last week for a "1st round game"... but all playoff games should be fairly competitive. I fully expect this week's game between CN and SRV to be good, too. I would not be surprised at all if CN wins.

There can be an argument to have some sort of involvement of enrollment, but 800 students at a public school is not the same as 800 at a private. It just isn't.

 

[larry legend33]

Put the bottle down Larry 🤣, usually you are right on, but not on this one.

The original original streak for De La Salle reached 44 games and was broken at the Coliseum in the 87 NCS final by Monte Vista 14-13. The year before De La Salle had moved up to 3A and beat Monte Vista 24 to 7.

The ‘87 game had trick plays, bench clearing fight and came down to the wire on a controversial two point conversion attempt Rob Forrester was “stopped” by Steve Abrams at the pylon (personally think je was in). At the time De La Salle was chasing Cardinal Newman’s win streak which was 47 and at the time was a state record (ended by San Marin in ‘77 or ‘78).

DLS and Newman did play for the 2A title at the Coliseum in ‘84 . Vice and Vaez led Newman and Panella DLS. DLS beat them like 38-20.

Its the purple drank @bella123 ..... I think I was getting mixed up withe Newman had the prior longest win streak in the state before DLS streak. Wasn't that in the 70-80s?

 

[observer22]

CN has to beat SRV and the loser of the Pitt/DLS game to advance to norcal correct? That is just insane. The Newman vs MC game was better than 90% of the bowl games/teams will be and that was a 1st round section game. What a joke.

I also think if Pitt wins they go but Folsom is ranked higher in virtually every poll.

If Pitt beats DLS, they will not only be 11-1 with their only loss being a tough battle (initially) to Bosco, but they’d be the first team in 34 years to beat DLS in the NCS playoffs. Certainly their ranking would improve with such a win, and it’s a better win than any of Folsom’s. The loss to Serra is way worse than losing to Bosco.

Yes, CN has to beat both SRV and the DLS-Pitt loser to advance to NorCal. I’m not saying they’ll do it, but I think they’ve got a puncher’s chance (and not 58 year old Tyson). SRV is solid, but Cal was within 5 points in the 4th quarter of their first matchup with SRV, and I think CN is a better team than Cal. Plus I read on here that CN is the slight favorite at least by 1 service.

If they beat SRV and face DLS, then I think their season’s over. But if they play a then 2-loss Pitt team that is beat up from just playing DLS, you just never know. Good luck to CN.

 

[larry legend33]

Put the bottle down Larry 🤣, usually you are right on, but not on this one.

The original original streak for De La Salle reached 44 games and was broken at the Coliseum in the 87 NCS final by Monte Vista 14-13. The year before De La Salle had moved up to 3A and beat Monte Vista 24 to 7.

The ‘87 game had trick plays, bench clearing fight and came down to the wire on a controversial two point conversion attempt Rob Forrester was “stopped” by Steve Abrams at the pylon (personally think je was in). At the time De La Salle was chasing Cardinal Newman’s win streak which was 47 and at the time was a state record (ended by San Marin in ‘77 or ‘78).

DLS and Newman did play for the 2A title at the Coliseum in ‘84 . Vice and Vaez led Newman and Panella DLS. DLS beat them like 38-20.

Its the purple drank @bella123 ..... I think I was getting mixed up withe Newman had the prior longest win streak in the state before DLS streak. Wasn't that in the 70-80s?

 

[WWHS44]

Its the purple drank @bella123 ..... I think I was getting mixed up withe Newman had the prior longest win streak in the state before DLS streak. Wasn't that in the 70-80s?

I was under the impression it was Hilmar with the longest streak before DLS...

 

[bella123]

Its the purple drank @bella123 ..... I think I was getting mixed up withe Newman had the prior longest win streak in the state before DLS streak. Wasn't that in the 70-80s?

Yes, mid 70s (47 games win streak) broken by San Marin.

 

[NorCalSportsFan]

Its the purple drank @bella123 ..... I think I was getting mixed up withe Newman had the prior longest win streak in the state before DLS streak. Wasn't that in the 70-80s?

On unbeaten streaks Palma had a long one that ended the 90s...Per Cal Hi Sports

"When the decade ended, Palma (which started playing football in 1954) had amassed a 114-7-0 record, including the final 36 games of a 47-0-1 unbeaten streak. The 114-7 record, which computes to a 94.2 winning percentage, is superior to any other for a single decade in California history with the exception of Concord De La Salle going 125-1 for the 1990s during its national record 151-game win streak.

To put it in even more perspective, Palma’s 114-7 is better than De La Salle’s state-best 105-10-1 for the 1980s or Ventura St. Bonaventure’s state-best 130-9 for the 2000s (not including forfeits) or even Cordova of Rancho Cordova’s state-best 102-6-1 for the 1970s."

Cardinal Newman win streak eclipsed Palma's 36 games but unbeaten streak by Chieftains was a record eclipsed by DLS and Newman. This could have been eclipsed since this was updated as of mid 2000.

 

[bella123]

Newman broke St. Helenas “unbeaten” streak set 60-65 at 46 games and 53 games without a loss, which stood as a public school record for years.

From September 16, 1960, through September 17, 1965, St. Helena High School won 46 consecutive football games. Then, on September 24, 1965, the Saints were tied by Vanden High School 0-0 at Carpy Field to end the win streak. Undeterred, the ’65 squad then rolled off 6 more victories that season before finally losing at Cloverdale 12-7 on November 11, 1965, completing a streak of 53 games without a loss, still a Northern California Public School record. "

 

[bella123]

I was under the impression it was Hilmar with the longest streak before DLS...

It was Cardinal Newman 1970’s win streak that DLS broke to set the record.

 

[NorCalSportsFan]

Newman broke St. Helenas “unbeaten” streak set 60-65 at 46 games and 53 games without a loss, which stood as a public school record for years.

From September 16, 1960, through September 17, 1965, St. Helena High School won 46 consecutive football games. Then, on September 24, 1965, the Saints were tied by Vanden High School 0-0 at Carpy Field to end the win streak. Undeterred, the ’65 squad then rolled off 6 more victories that season before finally losing at Cloverdale 12-7 on November 11, 1965, completing a streak of 53 games without a loss, still a Northern California Public School record. "

Must have been before CalHiSports counted.

 

[larry legend33]

Thanks guys. We have our very own Mark Tennis!
Good times down memory lane.

 

[Norcalguy111]

If Pitt beats DLS, they will not only be 11-1 with their only loss being a tough battle (initially) to Bosco, but they’d be the first team in 34 years to beat DLS in the NCS playoffs. Certainly their ranking would improve with such a win, and it’s a better win than any of Folsom’s. The loss to Serra is way worse than losing to Bosco.

Yes, CN has to beat both SRV and the DLS-Pitt loser to advance to NorCal. I’m not saying they’ll do it, but I think they’ve got a puncher’s chance (and not 58 year old Tyson). SRV is solid, but Cal was within 5 points in the 4th quarter of their first matchup with SRV, and I think CN is a better team than Cal. Plus I read on here that CN is the slight favorite at least by 1 service.

If they beat SRV and face DLS, then I think their season’s over. But if they play a then 2-loss Pitt team that is beat up from just playing DLS, you just never know. Good luck to CN.

SRV is a very scary squad right now. I think CN freshmeat QB will get eaten alive in Danville.

 

[FBAddict]

Must have been before CalHiSports counted.

Mark Tennis and his father has a deep tack record going back at least 100 years. If some team record has eclipsed their notice, I'm sure Mark would appreciate the proven data.

 

[THEOC89]

SRV is a very scary squad right now. I think CN freshmeat QB will get eaten alive in Danville.

I agree…. I don’t see anyway that CN can generate enough offense to beat SRV…. Other then against DLS, SRV’s defense led by Tx A&M Commit Marco Jones has played really well this year….

Good news for CN is I am wrong a lot, but I just don’t see it…. 🤣

 

[larry legend33]

I agree…. I don’t see anyway that CN can generate enough offense to beat SRV…. Other then against DLS, SRV’s defense led by Tx A&M Commit Marco Jones has played really well this year….

Good news for CN is I am wrong a lot, but I just don’t see it…. 🤣

Newman def comes in underdog.
But SRV gave up 28 to Amador Valley and escaped with a 1 point win. AM has given up a tons of points this year also.
I think all the scores will be low Friday. The weather is forecasted to be really bad. A grind it out game will help newman avoid a shootout. If you watch the MC game they won't let LT (QB) get in situations that take long to develop. If they pass it will be dink and ducks. If Gentry can break a couple long runs he has game changing speed. Newman will need to have that and a few breaks in the TO dept. Long shot but you never know...
Good opportunity for the young kid to play against a great team.

 

[THEOC89]

Newman def comes in underdog.
But SRV gave up 28 to Amador Valley and escaped with a 1 point win. AM has given up a tons of points this year also.
I think all the scores will be low Friday. The weather is forecasted to be really bad. A grind it out game will help newman avoid a shootout. If you watch the MC game they won't let LT (QB) get in situations that take long to develop. If they pass it will be dink and ducks. If Gentry can break a couple long runs he has game changing speed. Newman will need to have that and a few breaks in the TO dept. Long shot but you never know...
Good opportunity for the young kid to play against a great team.

Going to be a good one!!….