Assuming that the CCS authorities will mandate (mistakenly _ six would be more logical)) an eight-team Open bracket, these would seem to be the most likely units (as of late Tuesday): Mitty, SHC, SI, Pinewood, Crystal Springs, Los Gatos, Menlo-Atherton and, well, you make the call on the final outfit. Lots to choose from, none of them terribly attractive.
CCS Open teams
- Thread starter colhenrylives
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Two would be most logical!
Branham is 20-3 with wins over Los Gatos, Hollister and Valley Christian (but losses to Palo Alto and Monta Vista). I'm rooting for Hollister (17-3) just so people have to refer to the Haybalers.
Branham is 20-3 with wins over Los Gatos, Hollister and Valley Christian (but losses to Palo Alto and Monta Vista). I'm rooting for Hollister (17-3) just so people have to refer to the Haybalers.
Pinewood is at home vs Clet Saturday at 4… they might have to win that game to go into their open
To be clear, the CIF introduction of the Open Division in a number of sports was done, in large measure, to reflect the vast differences between public schools and their private/parochial counterparts. The obvious CIF aim is to cram as many of the latter into the Open so that the publics, who operate with significant geographic restrictions re enrollment, have more chances for section, regional and state titles. We can argue about what has become an "AYSO mentality" throughout the state, but the CIF's Open moves do reflect the big public vs. priate/parochial divide. One long-standing example: Since a girls' CCS hoops tourney was created more than 40 years ago, just one public school has won a state crown, Burlingame in 1988. The other 30-plus champions are all private/parochials. No public has even come close to Burlingame's achievement of 35 years ago. At least not yet. An irony now in 2023: Pinewood's inclusion as a CCS Open selection hinges almost solely on the performance of a senior transfer from Burlingame, Ava Uhrich. The Open format gives the publics a better chance to succeed at all levels of section, regional and state competition.
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I don't think it's either/or with Pinewood and Paly. To get to eight teams they should both go. I would note that St. Ignatius should also be one of the eight. They're likely to finish at 12-11 and 5-5 in league, without a marquee win. Pinewood, even with a loss to Clet, will probably be 13-10 and 9-1 in league.
Also, I don't know if this matters in the selection process, but Pinewood had four losses before Ava Uhrich was eligible. It has since beaten Salesian and Moreau. And its losses were to OTech, Cardinal Newman, St Mary's, Valley Vista (Az) and Crystal. Would Paly have done better against that group?
Also, I don't know if this matters in the selection process, but Pinewood had four losses before Ava Uhrich was eligible. It has since beaten Salesian and Moreau. And its losses were to OTech, Cardinal Newman, St Mary's, Valley Vista (Az) and Crystal. Would Paly have done better against that group?
Pinewood beat Salesian, Moreau Catholic, and Los Gatos
Strength of schedule only means something if you happen to beat some of the good teams on your schedule - Paly lost to all the good team
Converersley, Palo Alto doesn't have any bad losses. Pinewood lost to Los Altos (twice beaten by P.A.) and a 10-10 Riordan team.
Palo Alto finished its regular season with a convincing win over Homestead. They're 18-5. Agree, no bad losses. I can't come up with eight CCS teams better than Paly or Pinewood. Both should be in.
Meanwhile Branham, another open candidate, lost at the buzzer to Christopher. The game wasn't pretty. But the last shot, a baseline floater over Branham's 6'4"+ center, sure was. Branham had won 16 in a row, but falls to 20-4.
And unfortunately for those hoping for the Haybalers (17-4, 9-1), Hollister lost 63-46 to North Salinas (19-3, 9-1).
Meanwhile Branham, another open candidate, lost at the buzzer to Christopher. The game wasn't pretty. But the last shot, a baseline floater over Branham's 6'4"+ center, sure was. Branham had won 16 in a row, but falls to 20-4.
And unfortunately for those hoping for the Haybalers (17-4, 9-1), Hollister lost 63-46 to North Salinas (19-3, 9-1).
If PW wins just 2 of their final 3 and end up 13-10 I got them in the CCS Open. They avenged their Crystal Springs loss and have a big win over (NCS Open 1 or 2 seed) Salesian.
I mean honestly in the big picture with the competitve equity BS i could see their struggles paying off in the Norcals and PW ending up in Norcal D2/D3 and making a run.
I mean honestly in the big picture with the competitve equity BS i could see their struggles paying off in the Norcals and PW ending up in Norcal D2/D3 and making a run.
They need to prove they belong… so only two of the CCS open teams could beat Clet in their own gyms a day before opens are announced… I don’t agree
To be clear, I think Palo Alto is in for sure, but Pinewood will be seeded higher and would spank them. Good wins in Jan/Feb trump bad losses in December. Paly has no good wins.
None of the public schools mentioned here could beat them. SI lost to them. And Pinewood will lose to them also tonight - doesn't matter who's gym. Not enough depth, and Clet has enough depth/coaching to adjust to Pinewood's one remaining star.
One more time: The CCS honchos are misguided. There is no strong reason to mandate eight Open teams. Go with fewer. Avoid hideous mismatches. CCS overall is down this year. Quite down. Even the better privates are down, with the Sue Phillips AAU Gifted Hoops Academy the one notable exception. The publics, well, we all know the situation. Ouch.
Agree that CCS is quite down. And without Pinewood, the Open tournament is essentially a Mitty coronation. Missing its best player, Mitty twice beat SHC (who will be the #2 seed) by 20. It would be more interesting to give Mitty a bye to Norcal, and pick 8 mortals to play in CCS Open.
As for reducing it to six teams, that definitely would have helped last year. This year, there's not that much difference between #3 and #13.
As for reducing it to six teams, that definitely would have helped last year. This year, there's not that much difference between #3 and #13.
Pinewood played Carondelet tough, but lost by four (53-49). I'm sure if you asked Carondelet, they'd say Pinewood is an open team (and that they hope not to play them again in NorCals).
It is my understanding that no team or school can turn down the open. The “top” eight selected by the committee go…
Pretty you would get sanctioned, if I remember reading correctly.
You are correct that they can't refuse if selected, but they certainly ask. Last year Hillsdale was a clear open team but asked to not be selected as they felt they had a legitimate shot at the D2 CCS title. (Lost to Aragon in the final.) On the other end, HMB requested to be moved up and that request was honored.
Any guesses from the current top teams according to Maxpreps on who might ask not be selected?
In looking at your teams above, I agree that those would be the teams that go open as well.
I also believe the top four seeds, according to MaxPreps are locked in.
#1 Mitty
#2 Sacred Heart Cathedral (Three losses, two to Mitty, one to Salesian)
#3 Los Gatos (won their league and beat Paly twice)
#4 Palo Alto
Then it comes down to the final five teams that realistically have a shot.
Branham, SI, Crystal, Pinewood, and MA.
To me, Branham and SI are interchangeable, though the #5 seed has to play in Pool A with Mitty. SI has by far the more difficult schedule (though never really had close games against the likes of Mitty, Heritage, San Ramon, Carondelet, or Cardinal Newman). The committee might look at 11 losses against 4, and give Branham the #5, even though I think SI wins that game in a head-to-head matchup.
But let's say:
#5 Branham
#6 SI
The final two seeds come down to Pinewood, Crystal, and MA!
Pinewood has played a difficult schedule, and many of their early season losses were without Ava U. They are 10-5 since she started playing, with losses to Crystal, Cardinal Newman, Carondelet, St. Marys, Valley Vista, and Oakland Tech... In a weak CCS Open year, and years of history, they are in.... as long as they beat Menlo on Tuesday. If they lose, we will watch them destroy Div. 5. If Ava is able to play to start the year, they beat Uni, Riordan, and Los Altos and at the very least are 15-7.
Crystal.... is an interesting one. Easy nonleague schedule with blowout wins against a variety of schools. Just three good wins, Pinewood and two Menlo games. Just three losses, but to Summit Shasta (?) Riordan (who depending on the day can be ok) and Pinewood. Looking at MaxPreps, just three and four seasons ago... they were 2-15 and 2-16 (what happened there) If they beat Harker on Tuesday (0-9 league this year) they are in, but regardless of their MaxPreps Rating, pinewood should be ahead on Strength of Schedule over Crystal, considering they split and tied in their league. If they lose, send them back to div. 5.
MA, who finishes 22-2 and the lowest strength of the schedule of the top 9 teams by far, is sitting around waiting for an upset. If either Pinewood or Crystal loses on Tuesday, they hop in and get destroyed by the #1, and #4, and maybe play tough against Branham.
Agree with your analysis, but think Pinewod is a shoo in, regardless of Tuesday's outcome. I disagree that if M-A gets in they'd be destroyed by #4 Paly. I actually think they match up well with them and Branham. M-A is well coached, press and have nice length. Will be an interesting Open.
Great analysis. I will say this about CS and Summit Shasta, those are two teams that know each other very well and always play each other tough. They've played each other the last couple years in regular season and D5 CCS. I believe Shasta has the regular season wins but CS has the CCS wins, once in the championship 2 years ago and in Semis last year. Their games are very exciting as I've watched many in person since I know girls on both teams. Strong guard play on both sides.
Love to hear that. How would Pinewood or Crystal do against Branham, Paly, or SI? Assuming those two would struggle against Los Gatos or SHC... Haven't seen too much of the WBAL Foothill this year. Did watch the Pinewood/Menlo game #1 at Pinewood in person a few weeks ago, but don't know if BOTH Pinewood/Crystal should get in over a 22-2 (12-0) league champ, even if half the Peninsula-South is weak-ish.
Good point! Looks like they've played three four times in the past two years...
Crystal won in the D5 Championship @ Crystal (when they didn't have Norcal)
Summit won in the regular season last year @ Crystal
Crystal won in the D5 semifinal last year @ Summit
Summit won in the regular season @ Summit.
All close games!
If crystal didn't make the open, looks like that could be the d5 final again...unless pinewood doesn't make the open too!
I think what pinewood and CS really lack is size. Ava isn't a post but can play the part. SI has some 6 foot plus posts and could be tough for either team to stop. If memory serves, paly's top players are guards. Don't know much about Branham.
M-A at 22-2 is an interesting case. Their schedule is less than stellar. They have no signature wins. They did not play any of the WCAL schools or top teams in the WBAL. Their two losses came in December to teams in the Central Coast (San Luis Obispo, etc.) area outside CCS. They don't appear to have any outstanding college prospects on their roster. The entire PAL, both North and South, was not good this year. M-A took full advantage of that. Good for them. The door was shoved open during the summer. All three returning Division I scholarship post/wings transferred out (to Milpitas, Mitty and Pinewood). The loss of those three stripped the PAL South of its top talent. The PAL North is even less talented than the PAL South. The M-A 12-0 record in league play remains somewhat unimpressive. Still, 22-2, even in a down year for the PAL and CCS overall, can't be ignored. If the Bears argue to be included in the CCS Open Division, they probably get the nod. More power to them.
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On seedings, it's almost a matter of personal preference after the first two. I've got: Mitty, SHC, Los Gatos, SI, Paly, Crystal, Pinewood, Branham.
I think Branham's SOS got a boost playing De Anza Schools, and they did beat Los Gatos, but they lost to Paly and to Monta Vista They also just lost to Christopher. I think they are the last team in. But it wouldn't surprise me to see M-A take that spot.
WBBallFan said:
"Crystal.... is an interesting one. Easy nonleague schedule with blowout wins against a variety of schools. Just three good wins, Pinewood and two Menlo games."
It's at least four good wins. Crystal beat University, which is 21-4 and has itself beaten Pinewood. Crystal also had a dominating win over a solid Alisal team and wins over two other lower league champs. Agree, the turnaround in the program has been remarkable. That all should earn them more than an eight seed and a date with Mitty (whose star has returned just in time for CCS).
I think Branham's SOS got a boost playing De Anza Schools, and they did beat Los Gatos, but they lost to Paly and to Monta Vista They also just lost to Christopher. I think they are the last team in. But it wouldn't surprise me to see M-A take that spot.
WBBallFan said:
"Crystal.... is an interesting one. Easy nonleague schedule with blowout wins against a variety of schools. Just three good wins, Pinewood and two Menlo games."
It's at least four good wins. Crystal beat University, which is 21-4 and has itself beaten Pinewood. Crystal also had a dominating win over a solid Alisal team and wins over two other lower league champs. Agree, the turnaround in the program has been remarkable. That all should earn them more than an eight seed and a date with Mitty (whose star has returned just in time for CCS).
Im assuming you watched or attended the SI/SH game yesterday. It looks like SI can hang for about 2 1/2 quarters with SH and then the wheels fall off. Also that one referee, wow, i think he needs to re-evaluate his ability to correctly call a game. a blown call is fine but i think he had like 10 blown calls and the majority went against SH. Good thing the other ref overruled him on a few.
Yeah, he won no popularity contests yesterday! Lol. My daughter said after the game she was worried in the 3rd quarter but I had to remind her SI had s 3 or 4 point lead midway through the 3rd in the Bruce Mahoney too before SH pulled away with strong pressure forcing turnovers and easy buckets. I also told her it didn't help that she got in early foul trouble and missed some open looks in the first half. I think the biggest advantage SH has is experience. SI has some young talent and will be VERY good the next couple of years. Their freshman shooters kept them in the game.
Morgan Cheli returned last night for Archbishop Mitty after missing 17 games. Monarchs will win Nor Cals.
Also, I checked the teams south of San Jose (Hollister, Morgan Hill, Gilroy & Salinas) and over the summit along the coastline. There were several teams that had impressive records but I don't know about their strength of schedule rankings. Are you guys considering these CCS teams? I never hear any of them discussed...
Also, I checked the teams south of San Jose (Hollister, Morgan Hill, Gilroy & Salinas) and over the summit along the coastline. There were several teams that had impressive records but I don't know about their strength of schedule rankings. Are you guys considering these CCS teams? I never hear any of them discussed...
Probably any seed other than the top four teams. I know that SF Chronicle does not cover any of these schools south of Santa Clara County or along the coast.
The schools south of San Jose don't match up well with their northern counterparts. North Salinas, the best of the bunch, lost by 23 to Evergreen, the third place team in Branham's League.
The Haybalers of Hollister lost to Monta Vista, the 5th place team in Los Gatos' league, and to Branham.
Alisal, which took a game from North Salinas and went to OT with Hollister, lost to Crystal by 36.
The Haybalers of Hollister lost to Monta Vista, the 5th place team in Los Gatos' league, and to Branham.
Alisal, which took a game from North Salinas and went to OT with Hollister, lost to Crystal by 36.
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