Checking in: Cal Stars division

[ClayK]

So there's a lot of sturm und drang about various players, and generally the sentiment on this board, as in most places, favors the underdog. Obviously, I have a connection to Kelly Sopak and at one time did coach Cal Stars' youth teams, but no more, so factor in the bias ...

A few years ago, the argument was whether Morgan Green would be a better college player than Natalie Romeo.

Green played one year at Chabot, transferred to Michigan State, played reasonably well, and was dismissed from the team this year. In her one season, she averaged 4.0 ppg, shot 33.6% overall and 25% from three. She had 109 assists and 78 turnovers (1.4 A/TO).

Romeo played two years at Nebraska, and did very well. Last year, the same year for Green's stats above, Romeo averaged 16.0 ppg on 44.1% shooting (42.4% from beyond the arc) and had 93 assists and 67 turnovers (1.4 A/TO).

Last year, it was Aarion McDonald vs. Sabrina Ionescu. It's obviously hard to compare, as McDonald hasn't played yet due to injury but Ionescu has started all seven games, played the second most minutes, recorded the first triple-double in school history (and note that the Pac-12 career record is six) and is averaging 13 points, six rebounds and five assists a game.

So yes, it's fun to bash the big dog, but there just might be a reason the big dog is the big dog ...

 

[Streak One]

That was one of the bigger debates on our rankings (Green-Romeo) and it has played out as Romeo being the better player (We had Green in this issue).

Some non-basketball things altered this outcome, but it was clear we were wrong on this one

 

[Paytc]

Interesting topic that happened before I came aboard so I missed the original discussion.But since these are all kids, I wish them all well. Negative competition and measuring one's value against another is why the world is so envious, violent, and many are under achieving as much as they are. There is something eerily strange about the world's lust for competition and the resulting divide. We see it from kids competing for academic and athletic scholarships to competing new business trade, and more, That is why I wrote "Win Anyway" so people get away from letting others (who many times are just talentless haters) define who they are as a person or a player. The goal should always be to go out and be the best individual you can be and nothing else because we are not clones. Each and everyone of us are unique and incredible creations that can't be duplicated. So no adult should be putting one player down to build up another. But yes it happens. Because some adults are just miserable and inconsiderate on the impact it could have on an innocent child who most likely never asked for the comparison in the first place. Congratulations to Natalie Romeo on her continued success. And hopefully Morgan Green will bounce back from her set backs and also come out on top.

Competition is healthy when it is used to help everyone get better, not always used to define who is better. It's better to congratulate than it is to hate. Because there will always be someone who will come long and replace the champions and greats that came before them.

 

[RespectBBGame]

Clay

If your trying to compare why would you use Green to Romeo.?? Why not Moore ( Louisville ). compare high quality player?

The only reason McDonald not playing because she had surgery but will be back in 2 to 3 weeks. She also start on a top 10 team. Kick them why the down but I know how you are??????

Why not Compare Range Rover somebody else too or ever the biggest name Gray??????

 

[personalogic]

So there's a lot of sturm und drang about various players, and generally the sentiment on this board, as in most places, favors the underdog. Obviously, I have a connection to Kelly Sopak and at one time did coach Cal Stars' youth teams, but no more, so factor in the bias ...

A few years ago, the argument was whether Morgan Green would be a better college player than Natalie Romeo.

Green played one year at Chabot, transferred to Michigan State, played reasonably well, and was dismissed from the team this year. In her one season, she averaged 4.0 ppg, shot 33.6% overall and 25% from three. She had 109 assists and 78 turnovers (1.4 A/TO).

Romeo played two years at Nebraska, and did very well. Last year, the same year for Green's stats above, Romeo averaged 16.0 ppg on 44.1% shooting (42.4% from beyond the arc) and had 93 assists and 67 turnovers (1.4 A/TO).

Last year, it was Aarion McDonald vs. Sabrina Ionescu. It's obviously hard to compare, as McDonald hasn't played yet due to injury but Ionescu has started all seven games, played the second most minutes, recorded the first triple-double in school history (and note that the Pac-12 career record is six) and is averaging 13 points, six rebounds and five assists a game.

So yes, it's fun to bash the big dog, but there just might be a reason the big dog is the big dog ...

Clay, I am not sure what point you are trying to make. Are you saying that Ionescu is better than McDonald because she played for Cal Stars? Or that Romeo is better than Green for the same reason?

 

[ClayK]

The reason to compare Green and Romeo is that people were doing that on this board several years ago ... no one ever said Romeo (or Green) was at Mariya Moore's level -- or at least I hope they didn't.

The reason to use Cal Stars in the title is that many posters (you know who you are) tend to routinely downgrade Cal Stars' players and boost those from other clubs. That's fine, of course, and part of the discussion, so this is just extending that discussion.

McDonald, in fact, should be back this week and start playing for Washington. She should be a solid player for them once healthy, but Ionescu is proving to be an exceptional one -- and we can continue to compare and contrast throughout their college careers. (I think it's good for everyone to look back on their judgments and opinions and recall that they can be wrong as well as right, and I certainly have my share of the former.)

 

[Allprepmedia]

Clay,

Throwing shade will never work,instigating,sneak degrading,student athletes. I'm with respectbbgame on this 1. Aren't you a writer/journalist for maxpreps? I expect a lot more professionalism out of you. Bias opinions always playing both sides of the grass we all know you speak for Kelly,calstars! Let's talk about why you left Destiny Littleton off the mp aa team? Issue with Marlon Wells because his relationship with Harold-calhi sports?

 

[personalogic]

The reason to compare Green and Romeo is that people were doing that on this board several years ago ... no one ever said Romeo (or Green) was at Mariya Moore's level -- or at least I hope they didn't.

The reason to use Cal Stars in the title is that many posters (you know who you are) tend to routinely downgrade Cal Stars' players and boost those from other clubs. That's fine, of course, and part of the discussion, so this is just extending that discussion.

McDonald, in fact, should be back this week and start playing for Washington. She should be a solid player for them once healthy, but Ionescu is proving to be an exceptional one -- and we can continue to compare and contrast throughout their college careers. (I think it's good for everyone to look back on their judgments and opinions and recall that they can be wrong as well as right, and I certainly have my share of the former.)

Ok, so who are the upcoming Cal Stars Elite players who will follow in the footsteps of Romeo and Ionescu? Not the lateral acquisitions or the out of staters, but the Bay Area kids who have been in the Cal Stars program for awhile.

 

[RespectBBGame]

Personalogic

Does that mean the can't use DeCosta, Young or Johnson because they grew up as Stockton Mustangs. Oh don't let me forget Kahala was a Mustangs too !!!!!!

Everyone knows for years that Clay and Harold always was apart of Kelly promotional crew. Don't get me wrong more money more power!!!!!

 

[Norcal_Fan]

The reason to use Cal Stars in the title is that many posters (you know who you are) tend to routinely downgrade Cal Stars' players and boost those from other clubs. That's fine, of course, and part of the discussion, so this is just extending that discussion.


Haters are gonna hate, hate, hate! I think that a big reason why people are always taking shots at Cal-Stars is because of various things. You, yourself said in the past (many times) that players that don't play man to man are at a disadvantage when they go to college because all they know are zone principles (loosely said) and no concept of man to man. We all know that Kelly runs that 2-2-1 Vance Wallberg press (and they're pretty good at it too) and then a zone in the half court. What is he trying to teach them (at Miramonte or Cal Stars)? they run that dribble drive offense (again effective) which again, is a system. I mean it's better than running tons of sets. Kelly, for whatever reason has been able to recruit/attract the best talent in and outside the area. His programs are very successful.

The thing people don't understand is that AAU isn't about development it's about showcasing. Anyone who tells you otherwise, is a fool. Shoot, even Clay has said that. I think jealousy is part of the reason Cal Stars gets bagged on, and the other is that players are expendable and those that are demoted/cut talk smack (parents).

 

[RespectBBGame]

Norcal_fan

That not Vance Wallberg 2-2-1 press but I know where he got from. Wallberg was the AD James Logan high school in the mid 80'September. He just copied Coach Biggs defence. Wallberg teach a great man to man just like Biggs that coach at Eastbay. I know both of these coaches personally. So if know them and asked them they teach man to man over zone.

 

[ClayK]

How did Destiny Littleton get in this?

Still, one of my favorite threads, as on the one hand I'm accused of working against Harold Abend, and on the other working with him.

And you know, all credit (seriously) to the Stockton Mustangs. Lots of talent has come through that program in recent years.

As for the next group of Cal Stars, I really couldn't say. I think I saw the Elite team once last summer, I don't go to tryouts and I don't go to practices. A lot of people on this board would have more insight than I do, and I'm guessing personalogic is one of them.

It all goes in cycles. There was a time EBX was the top program, Cal Ballaz had a great run, and I'm sure the wheel will turn again. I was mainly talking about Romeo and Green, who were a hot topic on here for a while, and also Ionescu's hot start with Oregon. But who knows how it will play out?

 

[Willtalk]

If I remember correctly Clay never started the comparison between Ionescu and Mc Donald. It was another poster who spends his time stirring the pot. A lot of the criticism was not even directed at her basketball ability but her character. That was what the first exchange was about. After Ionescu was named to the Mc D AA team the same poster began the comparisons to justify that Mc Donald should have made it instead of her. It was RtG who created the comparison. Clay was just defending Sabrina not detracting from Mc Donald.

As to Clay needing to remain objective because he is linked with MaxPreps- On this site he is just another poster and fan. He is allowed to give his personal opinions. I personally take his posts in that vain. If I disagree then I tell him so. I do know that some posters - especially on the Cal site usually sychophantically deferj to him. Clay is usually objective and generally comports himself with dignity. It was Respects ( ironically he uses that as his moniker ) blatant attack on a player that pushed his button. That is the reaction that trash talkers usually are looking for.