How do we fix the CIF system?

[EthanRKassel]

I articulated my thoughts on the CIF's format and its pros and cons in a lengthy piece on my own site, which I'm going to shamelessly promote here. I'd just copy and paste the whole thing here, but I don't think putting 3,000 words here would be ideal.

Basically, the following questions need to be answered:
-What makes a Division I team, a Division II team, etc.?
-What makes a team a 1 seed or a 16 seed?

Close games are great. Blowouts suck. Avoiding them is good. But doing so through arbitrary cutoffs isn't the solution.

Please read and give me your thoughts! Nitpick at the tiniest of details if I got anything right or wrong. Give examples that I made the mistake of omitting! Let's have a fun discussion and try to create some real solutions here.

 

[bearphan]

I articulated my thoughts on the CIF's format and its pros and cons in a lengthy piece on my own site, which I'm going to shamelessly promote here. I'd just copy and paste the whole thing here, but I don't think putting 3,000 words here would be ideal.

Basically, the following questions need to be answered:
-What makes a Division I team, a Division II team, etc.?
-What makes a team a 1 seed or a 16 seed?

Close games are great. Blowouts suck. Avoiding them is good. But doing so through arbitrary cutoffs isn't the solution.

Please read and give me your thoughts! Nitpick at the tiniest of details if I got anything right or wrong. Give examples that I made the mistake of omitting! Let's have a fun discussion and try to create some real solutions here.

Great post and analysis!

 

[CalvinCambridge]

I articulated my thoughts on the CIF's format and its pros and cons in a lengthy piece on my own site, which I'm going to shamelessly promote here. I'd just copy and paste the whole thing here, but I don't think putting 3,000 words here would be ideal.

Basically, the following questions need to be answered:
-What makes a Division I team, a Division II team, etc.?
-What makes a team a 1 seed or a 16 seed?

Close games are great. Blowouts suck. Avoiding them is good. But doing so through arbitrary cutoffs isn't the solution.

Please read and give me your thoughts! Nitpick at the tiniest of details if I got anything right or wrong. Give examples that I made the mistake of omitting! Let's have a fun discussion and try to create some real solutions her

Make two separate tournaments, one for public schools and one for private schools. There would be public state champions and private state champions. Winning the D1 public state championship would be just as prestigious as winning the D1 private state championship. Divisions in the public school tournament would be decided by enrollment. Divisions in the private school tournament would be trickier but necessary for competitive equity.

 

[ankleassassin]

Make two separate tournaments, one for public schools and one for private schools. There would be public state champions and private state champions. Winning the D1 public state championship would be just as prestigious as winning the D1 private state championship. Divisions in the public school tournament would be decided by enrollment. Divisions in the private school tournament would be trickier but necessary for competitive equity.

played at the same time? might be stretching resources thin

 

[CalvinCambridge]

played at the same time? might be stretching resources thin

Cut down on a few divisions. D1 (2100 and above), D2 (1600-2099), D3 (1100-1599), D4 (600-1099), D5 (599 and below)

 

[iamgearyblvd]

Wasnt there one school one year recently for NorCals just forfeited their game rather than drive the 300+ miles away to play their playoff road game? Might have been lack of school funding or just lack of interest to get slaughtered, maybe both.

 

[SF_Mikey]

Go back to enrollment based divisions D1 - D5 - best of the best based on enrollments for public schools. Not sure there is an optimal solution for privates - possibly put all the private schools who don't make it to the Open in a separate private school division consisting of the top 8 - 16 or so top rated private schools. Putting Stuart Hall, University or even more extreme Sierra Canyon in D5 is a joke and was the main problem with the pre-competitive equity system IMHO.

 

[ankleassassin]

Wasnt there one school one year recently for NorCals just forfeited their game rather than drive the 300+ miles away to play their playoff road game? Might have been lack of school funding or just lack of interest to get slaughtered, maybe both.

this year

 

[ranhud]

Make two separate tournaments, one for public schools and one for private schools. There would be public state champions and private state champions. Winning the D1 public state championship would be just as prestigious as winning the D1 private state championship. Divisions in the public school tournament would be decided by enrollment. Divisions in the private school tournament would be trickier but necessary for competitive equity.

I agree on that. The odds are fair. We know private schools recruit. If a public school is caught, it's over for that school. So how can you actually compete.

 

[ranhud]

I agree on that. The odds are fair. We know private schools recruit. If a public school is caught, it's over for that school. So how can you actually compete.

Aren't fair

 

[NorCalBasketballFan]

Let's be real. There are plenty of Public schools that recruit and plenty of privates that don't. Public and private separate are not the answer. I believe keep the open and then everyone else staying in the division they participate with in their section is the way to go. Top private schools that don't make the open can be bumped up based off success like the SJS does (they need an open) if you don't win enough at the D1 level like a Capital Christian you bump down to D2.

 

[ankleassassin]

I agree on that. The odds are fair. We know private schools recruit. If a public school is caught, it's over for that school. So how can you actually compete.

most private schools dont want to battle with the few good ones. they really want to be left alone with their D5 or D6 title. Cornerstone, redwood and napa christian schools dont want any parts of DLS, BOD or Salesian

 

[CalvinCambridge]

In the past decade there have been 3 public school champions across the Open Division and Division 1. Same with the girls. Are we okay with that? Of course all of these private school coaches and fans want to keep the system the same because they like beating up on public schools. Football is even worse with no public schools ever having a chance of taking down private schools with dozens of D1 players.

 

[H.E.A.T.]

Let's be real. There are plenty of Public schools that recruit and plenty of privates that don't. Public and private separate are not the answer. I believe keep the open and then everyone else staying in the division they participate with in their section is the way to go. Top private schools that don't make the open can be bumped up based off success like the SJS does (they need an open) if you don't win enough at the D1 level like a Capital Christian you bump down to D2.

i actually thought SJS should have an open. But after seeing what Central section did in going away from the open and give all 8 qtr finalist in D1 and 4 in D2 D3 and D4 a trip to Norcal’s i’m not so sure. Either way the SJS is doing itself and it’s membership a disservice. . Still have to earn Your trip to Norcal . Unlike Central coast that awards Mediocrity. 5th place teams in league with A losing record shouldn’t be gifted a norcal bid.

 

[HSfan82]

In a simple response to many teams in CIF playoffs. Here my idea

OPEN Div
Only teams who play in section open OR are champions of any section are eligible to be open

The other divisions will mirror section to CIF. Only two finalist from division sections qualify for CIF. So this year OPEN is same plus Mitty. D1 is made of all D1 section winners plus some open section teams
In no particular order
1 DV
2 Dublin
3 MA
4 Los Gatos
5 Lincoln
6 SRV
7 Granada
8 Clayton
9 SI
10 HMB
11 serra
12 SH Prep
13 Branham
14 Bell
15-16 optional at large

D2
1 Christopher
2 VC
3 Mont
4 Benecia
5 Dinuba
6 Mission Prep
7 Vanden
8 Del Oro
9 Oakland
10 Oakland Tech
11-16 optional at large

Northern section kicks in at D3, SF and OAL will vary based on team.. you get the idea… all these teams listed are section champs or runner ups..

Quality teams like O’Dowd, Monterey Trail Inderkum , Jesuit ,Cap Christian Moreau can fill it as at large however they are section semi losers so are outside looking in