NCS seeding: O'Dowd or Piedmont

[ClayK]

So despite splitting two games, Piedmont is the designated league champ. That means they get a guaranteed first-round home game, but does it mean Piedmont should be seeded ahead of O'Dowd?

The NCS committee will make that call, and the default would be to go with the league designation.

But, look at MaxPreps:

Piedmont: 16-5 record, 22.19 rating, 13.7 strength of schedule
BOD: 15-5 record, 29.01 rating, 21.5 SOS (toughest in the section)

Both will be in the Open. One is likely to be the third or fourth seed, the other fifth or sixth.

Another issue: If they are seeded 3 and 6, or 4 or 5, they would play in the first round. Would NCS do that, or separate them to avoid a rematch?

There are other issues for the Open, of course, but this will be a test of whether the committee thinks it through or just takes the easy way out.

 

[LBJ6]

I don’t think guaranteed home game is a thing in the Open Division of NCS. It is for division 1 through 5. You could be a 5 seed opening on the road against a 12 seed league champ in D1. But If you remember, Acalanes was an undefeated league champion of the DAL and opened on the road At Carondelet as a 5 seed last year. No guaranteed home games in Open.

 

[ClayK]

From NCS: 1) Designated league champion will be the home team and the contest will be conducted in its geographical area. (First round only)

No mention of an exception for the Open. If you know of one, please point it out to me. It makes a big difference.

 

[Streak One]

So despite splitting two games, Piedmont is the designated league champ. That means they get a guaranteed first-round home game, but does it mean Piedmont should be seeded ahead of O'Dowd?

The NCS committee will make that call, and the default would be to go with the league designation.

But, look at MaxPreps:

Piedmont: 16-5 record, 22.19 rating, 13.7 strength of schedule
BOD: 15-5 record, 29.01 rating, 21.5 SOS (toughest in the section)

Both will be in the Open. One is likely to be the third or fourth seed, the other fifth or sixth.

Another issue: If they are seeded 3 and 6, or 4 or 5, they would play in the first round. Would NCS do that, or separate them to avoid a rematch?

There are other issues for the Open, of course, but this will be a test of whether the committee thinks it through or just takes the easy way out.

Do you know the reason why Piedmont would be the designated league champion?

 

[ClayK]

Some league rule about tiebreakers, as I understand it. Since there's no league playoffs, two or more teams can tie for first place, and you need a tiebreaker to determine the team that gets to host in the first round.

Some leagues give the nod to the team that wins the second game. Others have a preseason lottery where you draw numbers. If two teams are tied, the team with the lowest lottery number gets the NCS advantage.

I got this second-hand, so I could be wrong, but the source was pretty good. I could look it up somewhere but that seems like a little too much work.

 

[LBJ6]

From NCS: 1) Designated league champion will be the home team and the contest will be conducted in its geographical area. (First round only)

No mention of an exception for the Open. If you know of one, please point it out to me. It makes a big difference.

Ok so please explain why Acalanes played an opening round road game last year as an undefeated league champion in the 1st round. Because that rule does not apply to the open division.

 

[Streak One]

Ok so please explain why Acalanes played an opening round road game last year as an undefeated league champion in the 1st round. Because that rule does not apply to the open division.

Was it because Carondelet being independent gave them the EBAL league designation?

 

[LBJ6]

Was it because Carondelet being independent gave them the EBAL league designation?

That does not change the fact that Acalanes was still an undefeated designated league champ on the road

 

[Streak One]

Well I mean in Open, you probably will have overlap in league champions so you can still have the rule applied to Open, but have two league champions play each other in the first round.

In 2022, #3 San Ramon Valley traveled to #6 Heritage since Heritage was a league champion and SRV wasn't (top seed Carondelet was the EBAL champion)

CIF-North Coast Section

CIF-North Coast Section

cifncs.org

 

[LBJ6]

Well I mean in Open, you probably will have overlap in league champions so you can still have the rule applied to Open, but have two league champions play each other in the first round.

Ok But the point remains the same. Being a league champion in Open does NOT confirm you get a home game. That was my point. But I understand what you mean

 

[ClayK]

If there are two league champions playing in the first round, the higher seed gets the home game.

And there are also situations when a gym is not available, or the proper paperwork has not been filled out. (Back in the day, we lost a home NorCal game because there was a music festival in the gym.)

 

[Norcal_Fan]

Was it because Carondelet being independent gave them the EBAL league designation?

in theory, champions get home games but from what it appears, it's pure seeding in the open division. How C-Let still gets the automatic berth of the EBAL is beyond me. They are hardly an anomaly status anymore. When Margaret was there, they played a much tougher schedule and earned that right to have the anomaly label.

 

[ClayK]

Carondelet does not have the automatic berth any longer. It did for a while because the league coaches voted for it.

 

[Norcal_Fan]

Carondelet does not have the automatic berth any longer. It did for a while because the league coaches voted for it.

No kidding?? When did that happen, Clay?

 

[ClayK]

It started this year because the league teams agreed to put Carondelet on the full round robin. Before some teams didn't want to play Carondelet.

All of these decisions come from league meetings and the majority rules.

 

[becoolpt55]

Some teams didn’t want to play CLet?????
Who didn’t want to play CLet???
Sounds like something Sopak came up with…Mitty wanna be

 

[ClayK]

Some teams didn’t want to play CLet?????
Who didn’t want to play CLet???
Sounds like something Sopak came up with…Mitty wanna be

I can only repeat what I said. At the EBAL meetings, several girls' teams, in the past, did not want to play Carondelet. The coaches voted to allow only the teams that wanted to play Carondelet to play Carondelet -- no team would be forced to. In return for the missing games, Carondelet was given the automatic bid.

That changed last year.

And why the unnecessary dig at Kelly Sopak? He voted with the majority each time.

And I think we would all like to be like Mitty.

 

[becoolpt55]

So if the WCAL did the same thing what would happen… sounds convenient… I never heard of this….

 

[ClayK]

I don't know how other sections work, but this competitive anomaly exception is in the NCS bylaws.

Maybe you can insult the NCS Board of Governors for implementing it.

 

[becoolpt55]

Do the fans and players know about these
back door deals? Do coaches tell their
Players?

 

[becoolpt55]

Carondelet does not have the automatic berth any longer. It did for a while because the league coaches voted for it.

I smell a rat

 

[becoolpt55]

I don't know how other sections work, but this competitive anomaly exception is in the NCS bylaws.

Maybe you can insult the NCS Board of Governors for implementing it.

What other deals have been made…
I know just Trust Us….

 

[ClayK]

Deals? These are in the rules. The decisions are made in league meetings. I don't get your issue with this.

Competitive anomalies were created, discussed and voted on in public meetings.

 

[becoolpt55]

maybe nobody else thinks this is not right…guess nobody else even cares…
Amazing Crickets all around…
Guess most people accept what they are served

 

[Peninsula Pete]

@becoolpt55 ... try decaf

 

[ankleassassin]

maybe nobody else thinks this is not right…guess nobody else even cares…
Amazing Crickets all around…
Guess most people accept what they are served

or nobody cares as much as you do.

 

[salgovernaleisaturtle]

yeah, i don't see the issue. it's the same as St Mary's in the TCAL... they get to win league and don't have to play the league games. Or DLS in FB... I feel like there was one more 'independent' in fb or bkb I'm not thinking of.

1. no one benefits from a 100-8 blowout. The loser doesn't want to be there. The winner gets flak for pouring it on... and it's no benefit to the winner, since it's worse than practice sometimes. And no one wants to see an injury in one of those games.

2. if it's voted on, it's voted on. I remember some of the SFL schools wanting to vote folsom out for fb.. or was it make them independent? or something, and that was a controversy... but that never got the majority.

 

[Norcal_Fan]

I remember when Berkley was BERKLEY and the league was going to vote them out. They got the anomally and went and played a tough schedule every year. I imagine it's hard to find games outside of the league during league play, but as someone said, nobody wants to see a blow out every game. Their winning streak was crazy and wasn't till BOD got in the league where they started having closer games. Unfortunately, we saw what happned to Berkeley after Draper left...

 

[Chsmatt33]

If Piedmont gets selected to the open division for NCS then Bryan should be coach of the year in the Bay Area or least in the east bay and Natalia should be the player of the year in the Bay Area. The coaching job Bryan has done playing only 5 players and to get into the open if that is the case is one of the most impressive coaching jobs I have seen.

 

[Streak One]

in theory, champions get home games but from what it appears, it's pure seeding in the open division. How C-Let still gets the automatic berth of the EBAL is beyond me. They are hardly an anomaly status anymore. When Margaret was there, they played a much tougher schedule and earned that right to have the anomaly label.

It’s not pure seeding. As noted in the one I linked, a #6 seed heritage hosted a #3 seed San Ramon Valley in Open. It is very rare but could happen

 

[Streak One]

I actually like the independent path for some teams. Allows top teams to schedule more freely ifbthey so choose and limits unnecessary blowouts.

 

[observer22]

I actually like the independent path for some teams. Allows top teams to schedule more freely ifbthey so choose and limits unnecessary blowouts.

It works great when one team is clearly better than everyone else. But SRV has beaten C-Let a few times the last couple of years, so there’s no reason to just give them the league title. DLS in FB is a different story.

 

[Streak One]

It works great when one team is clearly better than everyone else. But SRV has beaten C-Let a few times the last couple of years, so there’s no reason to just give them the league title. DLS in FB is a different story.

Yes which is why the EBAL doesn't do it anymore. Acalanes right now would be a good example for it. They could still play their games against Miarmonte, but they have an average margin of victory fo 46 points and are 35-1 in league in the past three seasons.

Doesn't have to be a forever distinction, but nice to have for a stretch of time

 

[northbaybbguru]

If Piedmont gets selected to the open division for NCS then Bryan should be coach of the year in the Bay Area or least in the east bay and Natalia should be the player of the year in the Bay Area. The coaching job Bryan has done playing only 5 players and to get into the open if that is the case is one of the most impressive coaching jobs I have seen.

Absolutely 100% agree

 

[northbaybbguru]

Common sense says that if 2 league Champions meet in the 1st round of the OPEN the higher seed would get the home game. Not sure what the problem is here.

 

[northbaybbguru]

I think BOD will get the 4.

That win over SMS puts them in front of Acalanes who will be the 5 BUT Acalanes will HOST in the 1st round as league champ.

Piedmont will get the 6 seed and HOST the EBAL runner up #3 seed CLET in the 1st round.

That's my prediction.

A couple of crazy seeding happenstances for sure!

 

[bb-hoops]

How many teams will NCS Open division take? Its coming quick this Sunday seeding meetings. What's your prediction for the NCS Open ranking?

 

[Streak One]

I think they have always taken six teams. Seems like these are the six in some order

San Ramon Valley
Cardinal Newman
Carondelet
Bishop O'Dowd
Piedmont
Acalanes

 

[TheHillZ]

I think they have always taken six teams. Seems like these are the six in some order

San Ramon Valley
Cardinal Newman
Cardinal Newman
Bishop O'Dowd
Piedmont
Acalanes

It would be a really crazy year if Cardinal Newman has to play itself for the chance to advance!

 

[Chsmatt33]

I am pretty sure the second Cardinal Newman spot is supposed to be Carondelet