To some degree you are right - and perhaps the ones stay in a little longer than needed. But, I think Folsom could have been a ground n pound team yesterday. They can put a lot of guys into a running game. And the line looks like a good group of run blockers. If they continue to experience problems with their passing attack, I wouldn't be surprised to see a lot more involvement by the skill player in running plays - particularly against defenses that can apply pressure with 3 or 4 defensive lineman.
De La Salle vs Folsom
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To some degree you are right - and perhaps the ones stay in a little longer than needed. But, I think Folsom could have been a ground n pound team yesterday. They can put a lot of guys into a running game. And the line looks like a good group of run blockers. If they continue to experience problems with their passing attack, I wouldn't be surprised to see a lot more involvement by the skill player in running plays - particularly against defenses that can apply pressure with 3 or 4 defensive lineman.
This is a great call out. There were several points during the 2nd and 3rd quarters when I started to realize that Folsom was running out of chances. It's hard for most teams to get opportunities to score, let alone opportunities to take leads thus putting pressure the Spartans veer to dig them out of a hole -- something their not built to do. They're built to shorten the game and grind out first downs.
Folsom had numerous opportunities to take a lead in the 1st half. I think it was after the Joe Ngata penalty when I realized the game was about to get much shorter and they could very well get shut out.
Great points Thunder.
Crazy to think if a few small things go their way versus most things go against them, what would have happened.
If anything, this game signals a very fun upcoming year for NorC football! We have two amazing horses!
Folsom doesn't have any transfers, just ask cash-g61-l68-folsombulldog......all home grown.....lol..yeah right
And of course, "everyone's doing it" according to the same character.
He sounds like my teen when he is trying to convince me to let him do something that even he knows ain't right for him but a couple of his friends want to do...."c'mon Dad, everyone's doing it"
Good news is there are still adults around.
Everyone is doing it. Some are just getting better players.
A quick look at the Del Oro roster, reveals about half the team either not living in Loomis, not from Loomis, or transfers from neighborhood schools.
Does anyone care? Probably not. I dont. Everyone is playing by the same rules public school wise. If you dont like that another school is doing, do it better. If not, stop crying.
I see a lot of SFL posters complaining, trolling, and more complaining. I dont really get it. I actively root for all the other SFL teams and respect them greatly. It's fun to jab and so forth, but some of you take this wayyyyyy too seriously and personally. Get a grip. Root each other on. Everything is cyclic. The same teams that are good now probably wont be in 10 years.
My god..........
A quick look at the Del Oro roster, reveals about half the team either not living in Loomis, not from Loomis, or transfers from neighborhood schools.
Does anyone care? Probably not. I dont. Everyone is playing by the same rules public school wise. If you dont like that another school is doing, do it better. If not, stop crying.
I see a lot of SFL posters complaining, trolling, and more complaining. I dont really get it. I actively root for all the other SFL teams and respect them greatly. It's fun to jab and so forth, but some of you take this wayyyyyy too seriously and personally. Get a grip. Root each other on. Everything is cyclic. The same teams that are good now probably wont be in 10 years.
My god..........
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Every team gets transfers. The QBs who started on Friday for Granite Bay, Oak Ridge and Del Oro were transfers. I think Grant has starting QB transfer too. Not so at Rocklin but not everyone's dad is one of the offensive coaches.
It will be very interesting to see if that happens at Folsom. You know there's got to be Soph and Junior QBs out there that would think they could win an open competition. I think that is a real possibility.
It's funny to me. A transfer is someone who has attended another HIGH SCHOOL and effectively transfers to another at some point.
It isnt "well they used to live in this one place way back when so they count as a transfer!" If you have attended the same HS since you were a freshman, you aren't not a transfer. Lots of families move to attend certain high schools. This also applies to students not engaging in athletics. Heck, families move to attend private schools!
The funny thing is people KNOW Folsom doesn't really have transfers, per the definition of a transfer, so it has morphed into an excuse train about where each kid lived PRIOR to HS even starting. Halarious!
When people are hating, you must be doing something right. When they aren't hating is when you should be worried. Send more jealousy and envy our way. It fuels us.
My guess is that there is no envy or jealousy at all. There is an argument for and a reason to be proud of the fact that your team is principally made up of children of the good long-term tax-paying local families in your area. That is special and is something to be proud of.
A lot of people care. It's why the subject keeps coming up. The only reason all the movement is allowed is because MD sued CIF into submisssion. It's contributing to declining interest in HS football. Teams that were once powerhouses are now barely able to fill Freshman and JV rosters. If you like HS football you should care. The only people that don't care are those that are the benefactor of it. By the way, have you ever tried to build a competive program with genetically average kids? To just say "do it better" shows a complete lack of understanding. Doesn't matter how great of a coach a program has. All the staffs work hard and spend their lives trying to do what's right by their kids. So when you match genetically average kids against gifted kids backed by money, personal trainers etc, they won't compete.
Keeping my fingers crossed for Nor Cal football. Hope it's still around in 10/20 years.
Complaining about a public school enticing football players from outside its attendance zone rings somewhat hollow when you consider the inherent advantage that the private/parochials maintain. As a prime example in the Central Coast Section, the 2017 St. Francis-Mountain View WCAL roster of 70 guys embraced players from 25 different Bay Area cities, from San Bruno to Morgan Hill, from Newark to Milpitas and all points in between. Griping about public schools is almost laughable, especially in a section like CCS which has to deal with all eight of the WCAL schools on an annual basis. Folsom? God bless a powerhouse public school program in NorCal. There aren't a whole lot of them left on the map.
This!!!!!!!!
It's almost like the privates have a "right to success and players" and publics should just get the scraps or what's left in their general area. Comical.
Publics still have rules and the best public school programs are following every single rule.
Griping about this is comical.
A public school in NorCal just went toe to toe with DLS, a private school, operating under DIFFERENT rules than that public school. And we chose to piss and moan about a largely local team with local players, with a handful of kids who's parents chose to move there prior to they're kids starting HS, for the betterment of their kids?
Seems crazy to me. But hey, to each their own.
Good post by an adult. More people care than don't. Some have just given up and accepted what is happening at a few programs or are trying to justify what is happening at their school.
The traditional local rivalries are already well on their way to be ruined. My guess is that there will be new rivalries - pitting the schools with a large number of out-of-area players against the same, and the schools who are more locally based players against similar schools. School population size and travel costs are becoming a invalid basis on which to base league assignments.
I can agree to a point. Oakdale competes with CC every year. Oakdale has those genetically average kids. Escalon has the same. Multiple section championships. Hilmar has genetically average kids. They held the record for consecutive wins in high school football till DLS had their streak. But when a small or medium size school can't compete with those super athletes. I witnessed Oakdale at Serra state bowl. No matter how hard you practice or work out you can coach speed. Or size which Serra had both.
Good points.
Although I wouldn't compare Folsom as having "super athletes" like the factories in SoCal like MD and SJB have. No where near that.
There are people alluding to that and it simply isnt true.
Solid points though. And I agree to an extent that it has ruined some facets of HSFB. I miss the old days. Unfortunately things change. Adapt or die right?
Its mainly the same group of posters. From the SFL ironically. Mad because certain kids aren't choosing they're school. Pretty petty if you ask me.
I've said this before and I'll say it again. I believe a student-athlete should have the right to attend whatever school they choose --- as long as the school has room for them and isn't in turn squeezing out kids that actually reside within the specified boundary that also would like to attend. If there's room, let the parents drive their children where ever they're willing to take them.
Furthermore, to defend Folsom and even longer standing successful football programs such as Del Oro, Oakdale, Granite Bay, etc. They're no different than the powers that came before them. When Cordova was dominating in the 70's and 80's, aside from the Mather kids, they were drawing top athletes to their program too due to all the success they'd been having. Eventual pro QB Troy Taylor transferred over from Bella Vista. He was just one of many. This isn't at all a new development. It's been going on since the dawn of HS football and will continue.
Thing is, programs such as Cordova, Grant Union, Del Oro and now Folsom all earned their way to the point where young kids have been influenced and drawn to their program.
For example, Cordova hired a very good coach from the get go in Dewey Guerra. They hired him away from a very successful Folsom program at the time. But success didn't follow over night. The Lancers were dragged through the mud their 1st two seasons and it wasn't until year 5 that they won their first league title in the GEL. And it wasn't until year 9 that they ascended to the elite level they reached throughout the 70's. By the time the 80's rolled around, they had more wins the previous 10 years than any program in the Nation. That kind of success begets the transfers that follow.
When Chad Elliott transferred from highly successful Nevada Union to another highly successful program in Grant Union back in 1996, I'm sure it was for similar reasons. The long standing success/talent of the Pacers program and the opportunity to play within a system that better fit his skill set. Can anybody really argue that he made the wrong choice? He went from a run heavy wing-t to a pro set that featured several future NFL talents. Elliott ended up turning out what is still one of the most statistically impressive passing seasons ever. 47 TD passes with only 3 INT's. After a year at ARC to qualify academically, he parlayed the success into a scholarship to Syracuse. That may not have happened had he remained at NU.
When you look at the history's of Del Oro, Placer, Ponderosa and Folsom, you'll find similar paths as that of Cordova. Hell, people forget that Folsom's current run started only 10 years ago -- during Kris Richardson's 4th season as head coach -- and that they didn't truly hit elite status in the SJS until 2010. From 1991 - 2007 they were a very pedestrian 87-81-5 with only 3 playoff appearances (in 17 seasons) and no playoff wins.
The point is, just like Cordova, Grant Union, Del Oro, Oakdale, Nevada Union, Escalon and many others before them, Folsom had to build the winning culture from scratch. Now they are just enjoying the windfall of all that hard work.
Things tend to be cyclical and it could very well end with Folsom soon and begin some place else.
To summarize, I can't blame Folsom's program for the fact that it's attracting impressionable young men (and their parents). If they're doing something illegally, that's different. But I haven't heard, read or seen anything to make me believe that. Same goes for Del Oro.
Furthermore, to defend Folsom and even longer standing successful football programs such as Del Oro, Oakdale, Granite Bay, etc. They're no different than the powers that came before them. When Cordova was dominating in the 70's and 80's, aside from the Mather kids, they were drawing top athletes to their program too due to all the success they'd been having. Eventual pro QB Troy Taylor transferred over from Bella Vista. He was just one of many. This isn't at all a new development. It's been going on since the dawn of HS football and will continue.
Thing is, programs such as Cordova, Grant Union, Del Oro and now Folsom all earned their way to the point where young kids have been influenced and drawn to their program.
For example, Cordova hired a very good coach from the get go in Dewey Guerra. They hired him away from a very successful Folsom program at the time. But success didn't follow over night. The Lancers were dragged through the mud their 1st two seasons and it wasn't until year 5 that they won their first league title in the GEL. And it wasn't until year 9 that they ascended to the elite level they reached throughout the 70's. By the time the 80's rolled around, they had more wins the previous 10 years than any program in the Nation. That kind of success begets the transfers that follow.
When Chad Elliott transferred from highly successful Nevada Union to another highly successful program in Grant Union back in 1996, I'm sure it was for similar reasons. The long standing success/talent of the Pacers program and the opportunity to play within a system that better fit his skill set. Can anybody really argue that he made the wrong choice? He went from a run heavy wing-t to a pro set that featured several future NFL talents. Elliott ended up turning out what is still one of the most statistically impressive passing seasons ever. 47 TD passes with only 3 INT's. After a year at ARC to qualify academically, he parlayed the success into a scholarship to Syracuse. That may not have happened had he remained at NU.
When you look at the history's of Del Oro, Placer, Ponderosa and Folsom, you'll find similar paths as that of Cordova. Hell, people forget that Folsom's current run started only 10 years ago -- during Kris Richardson's 4th season as head coach -- and that they didn't truly hit elite status in the SJS until 2010. From 1991 - 2007 they were a very pedestrian 87-81-5 with only 3 playoff appearances (in 17 seasons) and no playoff wins.
The point is, just like Cordova, Grant Union, Del Oro, Oakdale, Nevada Union, Escalon and many others before them, Folsom had to build the winning culture from scratch. Now they are just enjoying the windfall of all that hard work.
Things tend to be cyclical and it could very well end with Folsom soon and begin some place else.
To summarize, I can't blame Folsom's program for the fact that it's attracting impressionable young men (and their parents). If they're doing something illegally, that's different. But I haven't heard, read or seen anything to make me believe that. Same goes for Del Oro.
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DLS has been battled tested for years against the best . Folsom was not. That fact was the difference. Folsom has scheduled tomato can slappies. And run up impressive scores , then when they play someone that has a pulse .They wilted when it was all on the line.
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The whole Folsom area attracts parents and kids. What isn't to like? Cheap housing, outstanding recreation, brand new and gorgeous developments going in, and way above average public schools (list can go on). Folsom high, in particular, has great academics and a well respected football program to boot. If you live anywhere near there and wanted your kid to play football, why wouldn't you make an effort to go to Folsom.
Same applies to DLS.
Now its harder for public schools and a little taboo because when there is a good local public school, the local community doesn't like to share. So those outsider transfers are frowned upon. In the East Bay, when Clayton Valley went charter, the Northgate community flipped! Clayton residents were included in Northgate jurisdiction and Northgate community didn't like that.
I don't think Folsom has that issue..
Now on the SJB and MD situation, I think that is wrong. And the IMG situation LMAO
Imagine if Folsom's best 3 players transferred to DLS next year since it is supposed to be a Folsom down year, thats what those so cal teams are doing.
Same applies to DLS.
Now its harder for public schools and a little taboo because when there is a good local public school, the local community doesn't like to share. So those outsider transfers are frowned upon. In the East Bay, when Clayton Valley went charter, the Northgate community flipped! Clayton residents were included in Northgate jurisdiction and Northgate community didn't like that.
I don't think Folsom has that issue..
Now on the SJB and MD situation, I think that is wrong. And the IMG situation LMAO
Imagine if Folsom's best 3 players transferred to DLS next year since it is supposed to be a Folsom down year, thats what those so cal teams are doing.
Only from a coaching perspective.
The "years" of battle tested experience you speak of didn't involve any of the kids playing Varsity for DLS on Friday night. They don't get to piggyback teams from 5, 10, 20 years ago.
The Spartans SOPH QB was making his very first start. And numerous other starters had limited experience at the Varsity level. Sure, there were some Sophs, Juniors and Seniors that were part of the team last season and the year before. Might even be 1 or 2 that played Varsity as frosh, IDK. However, those were also years DLS got curb stomped by St. John Bosco, Bishop Gorman and Mater Dei by a combined score of 142-61. And many of those kids didn't play key roles in those marquee games either.
Conversely, Folsom returned players that participated in a title run in 2017 that also included some big game experience in the post season.
You're grasping at straws if you really believe three games the Spartans largely weren't competitive in the past two seasons made any difference from a player perspective.
DLS's in-game and halftime adjustments surely played a factor. I pointed that out after the game. So did DLS's defensive effort. But other big factors were the unforced turnovers and penalties by Folsom that cost them 2 scoring chances inside the 1 yard line. Whatever level the Spartans were battle tested or not played no role in that whatsoever. If neither mistake was made and had Folsom scored on either or both possessions and somehow won the game, it wouldn't have made Folsom any better or worse of a team.
I get that DLS/NCS/East Bay fans are tired of all the Folsom talk and are enjoying the W. More power to you. But don't get carried away.
Agree or disagree with your analysis....T-Ram your posts just blew past the definition of good. If there was a Prep sports writing category in the ESPYS these posts should be nominated.
I don't know what you do for a day job but you might think about giving it up for sports writing/analysis.....if the pay is good, of course.
In the meantime keep your laptop charged and your posts frequent. Thank you.
Haha I was gonna say the same thing. Its damn pricey here now my god!Perhaps when compared to where golfpilot lives.
I can't count on one hand the friends that have moved up there from the Bay Area. My last friend traded his ultra humble hut in Walnut Creek for something that could qualify as a castle just down the street from Folsom lake. His reasons were all valid, good public schools for his kids being one of them, and everytime I go there I scratch my head because it is awesome. I'd bet very few Folsom folks, if any, drove down treat on Friday and said "I really want to live here". Price aside.
Good post Thunder. All is true BUT we are talking degrees. Good schools and great communities attract some, good football attracts others and some may come due to influence from camps or 7 on 7 coaches.
CIF says it's fine now. I accept it is a reality but I don't like it and what I especially don't like is the chest thumping that goes on with it and the shrieking for respect. I don't respect nor admire that quality and unfortunately, it exists at a couple of programs.
I respect programs like Oakdale, Bear River, Colfax, Placer, and others who play (largely) with their own kids, they are reflective of their communities...they're not made up of Hessians fighting the battle for a community where they have no ties. To me, that is high school football. Call me an idealist. Don't really care.
I can assure you that on the ground, I am not the only person that feels this way. It's not a jealousy thing, its a disappointment with where things are going and the ego's that get pumped up with it.
Spot on brother. I will say that it has changed a ton in the last 5 or 6 years. Many people from the Bay are relocating, and what was once considered a "cheaper" area to live, is now on the higher scale for the region. I am happy I bought when I did. I am also near Folsom lake and wouldn't trade it for the world. My kids have all funneled through the public school system and moved into the UC system.
It is a great community that provides an amazing quality of life. The only problem is, this used to be a well kept secret. That cat is now out of the bad. Hopefully it stays how it is now for at least a little longer!
Thanks for the kind words though.
I have said this before, and I will say it again- the biggest complainers about schools like Folsom, are other SFL school posters. Some of them will identify with a certain school, others are afraid to, for whatever reasons. But we know who they are. The constant complaining is so ironic, considering schools like Del Oro usually have MORE kids from outside of the community on their rosters than schools like Folsom or Oak Ridge! Everyone supports parents rights to send their kids to certain schools, within the rules, until they pick a school you don't like, or you have to play in league. That is ridiculous.
Loomis is a TINY little town, and somehow always comes up with some of the most talented kids in the area. Yes, some are homegrown Loomis kids, but a majority are usually from surrounding areas, other schools, and even other regions. They came to Del Oro for various reasons, which includes a great school and athletic prorgrams. Absolutely nothing wrong with this. It is a testament to that school a community.
You cannot be for one thing when it benefits your team, but then chastise others when it benefits them, on the sole basis that "you don't like the chest bumping." Are we five years old? This is athletics! You have the same opportunity to make your program great, which in turn attracts others to want to come their and be part of your program. You can't say, "well we also have 10 out of area kids in our program, but its not fair because your out of area kids are better!" C'mon man. Be an adult.
Let's keep this football related from now on. The jealousy, envy, and ridiculous accusations are old. Nobody cares except for a handful a posters, which is the extreme minority. Let's enjoy some football.
Loomis is a TINY little town, and somehow always comes up with some of the most talented kids in the area. Yes, some are homegrown Loomis kids, but a majority are usually from surrounding areas, other schools, and even other regions. They came to Del Oro for various reasons, which includes a great school and athletic prorgrams. Absolutely nothing wrong with this. It is a testament to that school a community.
You cannot be for one thing when it benefits your team, but then chastise others when it benefits them, on the sole basis that "you don't like the chest bumping." Are we five years old? This is athletics! You have the same opportunity to make your program great, which in turn attracts others to want to come their and be part of your program. You can't say, "well we also have 10 out of area kids in our program, but its not fair because your out of area kids are better!" C'mon man. Be an adult.
Let's keep this football related from now on. The jealousy, envy, and ridiculous accusations are old. Nobody cares except for a handful a posters, which is the extreme minority. Let's enjoy some football.
Interesting look at the Folsom "fumble" from the DLS game.
No this doesn't mean Folsom would have won. Save the trolling. This is for discussion only.
https://sacramento.cbslocal.com/video/3920064-folsom-high-school-fumble/
No this doesn't mean Folsom would have won. Save the trolling. This is for discussion only.
https://sacramento.cbslocal.com/video/3920064-folsom-high-school-fumble/
All this moving around does lead to wierd results. I seriously wonder how many of the playmakers at Oak Ridge were Folsom players who decided to attend Oak Ridge because Folsom had such an influx of out of area players. Imagine it...you go to cheer for your team at the Oak Ridge-Folsom game....to some degree, and not totally, you are cheering for the Folsom kids to beat Folsom? Its just odd.
If you are watching the goal line, you aren't watching for a knee, wrong call, and nobody is going to argue against that, but you'd be hard pressed to call it sided reffing. Had the kid held onto that reach it likely would have been ruled a touchdown. There are no replays, kids know that, need to keep the ball in your hands until the whistle blows. When there are no replays the way it appears plays a big part in how it is called, right or wrong.
Does anybody have a video of the DLS fumble while crossing the goaline? I'm curious what that one looked like, it was on the opposite side of the field
Or going to a Del Oro game and seeing kids from Whitney, Rocklin, and Roseville. Its pretty common across the board.
I agree. I think what made it tough is because he reached out for the goal line. He was obviously down but the refs weren't looking at that. Either way wrong call but you still have to be able to overcome.
I think what most people on the folsom side are upset with is that it changed the entire complexion of the game. Still no way to ever know and frankly it doesn't matter. But to give DLS defense a do over with a touchback on the 20 yard line is a pretty tough thing to swallow in such a big close game.
The DLS fumble was a bit more obvious as the ball popped out while To'too dove for the goal line.
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You might want to add Jesuit, Christian Brothers, Capitol Christian, Vista, Cordova, Granite Bay, Bella Vista and others to that list. It's not uncommon for Jr. Bulldogs to move on as there place becomes clear. It's never been about an influx of out of area players, but numerous reasons including competition for playing time and best fit for education. It truly is a 2 way street.
Officials miss quite a few calls in most HS games. The issue surfaces mainly when there are lots of errors in one game or when one especially notable miscall comes like this one. The unreviewable decisions of refs is part of the game - we all know that - but it is frustrating when it changes the outcome of game. It probably wouldn't have changed who won the game, but it did change the eventual outcome of a scoreless Folsom offensive effort.
That being said, I'm sure the official in question is embarrassed and he most likely will pay more attention in other situations like it in the future. Simply put - its part of the game and I don't fault this guy's overall performance. And I don't give any credence to some posters comments about a biased officiating crew.
