NCS Brackets

[Truthhertz]

I don’t think anyone supports the idea that a team’s schedule doesn’t matter. Every schedule has some key games, and you have to win those in order to reach your goals. CVC and Liberty each won the most important game on their schedule to get into the much preferred 2-3 slot.

One team has been a perineal open competitor and plays in a D2/3 league and scheduled 1 quality opponent.(Pitt) the rest of their schedule was frankly pathetic for a team wanting to be considered with the elite of the state. The other team plays in a D1 league considered to be one of the best in NorCal and schedule a equally pathetic non league schedule. Team “B” I’m not sure expected to be where they are today going in and probably scheduled accordingly. Team “A” expected to be there and scheduled to make sure they would be. Team “A” was iffy in regards to game #1 and scheduled assuming they may lose and booked pushovers to make sure they ended 9-1. They in fact ended 9-1 but lost to a team also not worthy of being considered in any of the states elite brackets. Honestly to fix the issue everybody should be in a D1 bracket. (DLS included) Play it out top team goes open #2 goes to regional game. But backing into a open bid by scheduling down regardless of week one head to head is pretty weak. In terms of these lower division teams being placed in the open and moving back to their respective divisions if bounced, thats already in play as I understand it. It’s why I make the case for lower division teams with same 9-1 or 10-0 records to be considered over teams that clearly schedule down. Its the freaking open! Schedule like You belong in it!

 

[remc]

Outstanding post noknight. That is the exact scenario that should be in play. That way, teams have an incentive to make the Open and get a crack at Sparty, but are still alive if they don’t shock the world and everyone else still has a shot at the other state game if they just keep winning. A lower division team having a great season like CN or Moreau could take their chance at DLS, but not have their season end and get out back into their original division bracket. I like it.

One team has been a perineal open competitor and plays in a D2/3 league and scheduled 1 quality opponent.(Pitt) the rest of their schedule was frankly pathetic for a team wanting to be considered with the elite of the state. The other team plays in a D1 league considered to be one of the best in NorCal and schedule a equally pathetic non league schedule. Team “B” I’m not sure expected to be where they are today going in and probably scheduled accordingly. Team “A” expected to be there and scheduled to make sure they would be. Team “A” was iffy in regards to game #1 and scheduled assuming they may lose and booked pushovers to make sure they ended 9-1. They in fact ended 9-1 but lost to a team also not worthy of being considered in any of the states elite brackets. Honestly to fix the issue everybody should be in a D1 bracket. (DLS included) Play it out top team goes open #2 goes to regional game. But backing into a open bid by scheduling down regardless of week one head to head is pretty weak. In terms of these lower division teams being placed in the open and moving back to their respective divisions if bounced, thats already in play as I understand it. It’s why I make the case for lower division teams with same 9-1 or 10-0 records to be considered over teams that clearly schedule down. Its the freaking open! Schedule like You belong in it!

Can’t disagree about the scheduling aspect

 

[1tunz1]

Based on the schedules the 2&3 seed played I’m not sure why any team would challenge themselves who want to be considered for the open. Liberty at least plays a D1 league schedule preseason wasn’t worthy of a open team. CVC plays a D2/3 league and scheduled a D5 team, along with some Terrible teams other than Pitt to round out their schedule. The only other note worthy team they played they lost to. In my opinion Open teams should challenge themselves to be considered. Pitt definitely challenged themselves and for their troubles teams that didn’t get higher seeding. I get why Liberty is they won Pitts league, and played a D1 schedule. I mean if league title and record is all that matters Las Lomas won league title and they were undefeated, why are they not worthy under these flimsy requirements? Want to be a open team challenge yourself like elite teams should.

Thing is, there’s 2 teams advancing from the Open. So these teams you refer to are scheduling and playing for the D1 slot in the Open, not the Open slot, which everyone knows Defaults to DLS every year. The only real option for the others is to play for the other spot, which means the 2or 3seed. CVC only needed to schedule and beat Pitt to accomplish this, and they did. Kudos to them. As for Pitt, their program will grow stronger by playing the CC’s of socal and similar competition, and this kind of scheduling may attract better players each year as well, but it takes a few years to grow like that ( ala Schools like Del Oro, who scheduled way over their head at first, but got way better because of it). On the other hand, won/ loss record counts so there must be a balance, related to your teams actual capabilities, and what a team can actually pull off logistically and financially. Also for every school that schedules up, theres a corresponding strong school who then schedules down. Theres only so many teams, and so many matchups like you refer to that can be pulled off, even if a team wants 10 elite games. Just doesnt happen. And then, teams are stuck with their own league, however strong or weak it may be. Also, scheduling a strong team 1-2 years in advance doesnt mean they will be strong by the time you play them. Changes every year for most teams, except the perennial elite. But no matter how strong a teams schedule, they have to win the important games, and Pitt did not, losing to CV and Liberty. And that makes the seeds a done deal. Its obvious to me most of these posts in this thread are Pitt fans venting, rationalizing, grieving ( whatever you want to call it), over getting the 4 seed and having to play DLS and win or go home. But by the same rationale of D1 teams scheduling tough to be prepared for the Open, Pitt did a good job of that, and therefore should be happy they are getting what they prepared for....a match with Norcals best ( unless of course, they were playing for that D1 spot as well... which meant forget CC, but beat Liberty and CVC).

 

[Truthhertz]

Thing is, there’s 2 teams advancing from the Open. So these teams you refer to are scheduling and playing for the D1 slot in the Open, not the Open slot, which everyone knows Defaults to DLS every year. The only real option for the others is to play for the other spot, which means the 2or 3seed. CVC only needed to schedule and beat Pitt to accomplish this, and they did. Kudos to them. As for Pitt, their program will grow stronger by playing the CC’s of socal and similar competition, and this kind of scheduling may attract better players each year as well, but it takes a few years to grow like that ( ala Schools like Del Oro, who scheduled way over their head at first, but got way better because of it). On the other hand, won/ loss record counts so there must be a balance, related to your teams actual capabilities, and what a team can actually pull off logistically and financially. Also for every school that schedules up, theres a corresponding strong school who then schedules down. Theres only so many teams, and so many matchups like you refer to that can be pulled off, even if a team wants 10 elite games. Just doesnt happen. And then, teams are stuck with their own league, however strong or weak it may be. Also, scheduling a strong team 1-2 years in advance doesnt mean they will be strong by the time you play them. Changes every year for most teams, except the perennial elite. But no matter how strong a teams schedule, they have to win the important games, and Pitt did not, losing to CV and Liberty. And that makes the seeds a done deal. Its obvious to me most of these posts in this thread are Pitt fans venting, rationalizing, grieving ( whatever you want to call it), over getting the 4 seed and having to play DLS and win or go home. But by the same rationale of D1 teams scheduling tough to be prepared for the Open, Pitt did a good job of that, and therefore should be happy they are getting what they prepared for....a match with Norcals best ( unless of course, they were playing for that D1 spot as well... which meant forget CC, but beat Liberty and CVC).

All sounds great until you look at the elephant in the room right? CV lost to Antioch when in mid season form, Pitt boat raced Antioch. Both Antioch and Pitt play in a D1 league CV doesn’t. Pitt lost a week one March up to CV yes I get that. But again CV lost to a team not even in the open conversation. Again place everybody in D1 bracket and play it out, winner of bracket gets open, runner up goes D1. Either that or start including these D2/3 teams in open who actually challenge themselves since they won’t get bounced with a loss anyway.

 

[noknight]

I don't have a horse in this fight, but it seems abundantly clear that @Truthhertz has an ax to grind with respect to CVC.

Or, like Ice-T said:

Every team with Open aspirations knows what needs to be done. CVC played the game (by the known rules) better than Pitt. For that matter, they played their actual game AGAINST Pitt better than Pitt.

Here's a hint - unless the rules change (and there's no indication they will), then Pitt knows if they want to avoid the 4 seed, they better make sure they beat CVC next season. Not rocket science.

 

[observer22]

Here's a hint - unless the rules change (and there's no indication they will), then Pitt knows if they want to avoid the 4 seed, they better make sure they beat CVC next season. Not rocket science.

Or, and I hope this is not the case, avoid playing CVC in the preseason and make sure you have a stronger SOS. Even so, with 3 losses (I know, 1 was to CVC) this year to CVC’s 1, it is still possible the committee would have placed CVC ahead of Pitt in the Open even if they hadn’t already settled it on the field. Some people on here commented they felt Pitt may not even get an Open bid with 3 losses. But thankfully the committee selected the best 4 teams.

I like seeing the top teams play each other in the preseason so we can see how they stack up. With the split of the EBAL this year into A & B divisions, it enabled us to see a bunch of EBAL-BVAL matchups, which was great. I wish there was some way to have CVC play at least 1 top BVAL team and one EBAL Mtn team each year, in addition to them playing some challenging OOS games, since the DFAL is mostly just D2/D3. Again I’d rather just see them be placed into one of those leagues.

 

[remc]

Or, and I hope this is not the case, avoid playing CVC in the preseason and make sure you have a stronger SOS. Even so, with 3 losses (I know, 1 was to CVC) this year to CVC’s 1, it is still possible the committee would have placed CVC ahead of Pitt in the Open even if they hadn’t already settled it on the field. Some people on here commented they felt Pitt may not even get an Open bid with 3 losses. But thankfully the committee selected the best 4 teams.

I like seeing the top teams play each other in the preseason so we can see how they stack up. With the split of the EBAL this year into A & B divisions, it enabled us to see a bunch of EBAL-BVAL matchups, which was great. I wish there was some way to have CVC play at least 1 top BVAL team and one EBAL Mtn team each year, in addition to them playing some challenging OOS games, since the DFAL is mostly just D2/D3. Again I’d rather just see them be placed into one of those leagues.

Would have really been interesting had Antioch beaten Pitt. Then Antioch 3 and CVC 4?

 

[observer22]

Would have really been interesting had Antioch beaten Pitt. Then Antioch 3 and CVC 4?

I think you’re right. That would have been CVC’s worst fear.

 

[noknight]

Would have really been interesting had Antioch beaten Pitt. Then Antioch 3 and CVC 4?

I think that's right. At least it would have been in keeping with the way the committee has always done things. If @1tunz1 is right about Open participants automatically getting postseason nods, then I think a case could have been made for CN.

 

[Truthhertz]

I don't have a horse in this fight, but it seems abundantly clear that @Truthhertz has an ax to grind with respect to CVC.

Or, like Ice-T said:

Every team with Open aspirations knows what needs to be done. CVC played the game (by the known rules) better than Pitt. For that matter, they played their actual game AGAINST Pitt better than Pitt.

Here's a hint - unless the rules change (and there's no indication they will), then Pitt knows if they want to avoid the 4 seed, they better make sure they beat CVC next season. Not rocket science.

No axe to grind with CV I have them beating Liberty in another thread. My issue is with the process at play here. As to your hints and smart arse comments I get head to heads buddy, I also understand strength of schedule, I also get week 1 play verse week 9 play. The only hint for Pitt would be, why even schedule CV or any other opponent that they may lose to in preseason? Book Stellar Prep and Berean etc, and rely on league strength for seeding. They would never risk being the 4 in this case because CV league is pathetic. Seems like a sound way to go I guess. I think it stinks for fans, kids etc, but hey I guess thats NCS football.

 

[mansnothot]

What's the difference between Las Lomas league vs CVC league?

Any agreements for LL to be in the open?

 

[observer22]

What's the difference between Las Lomas league vs CVC league?

Any agreements for LL to be in the open?

They’re actually in the same league, but different divisions. Similar to the EBAL, the DAL has an A division (Campo, CVC, Miramonte, Acalanes, Northgate & Alhambra), while the B division has such teams as LL, CP, MD, YV, Concord & Berean. Apples to Oranges.

LL has a pretty good team this year, but wouldn’t be undefeated if they played CVC, Campo & Miramonte. Might have 3 losses.

 

[Truthhertz]

What's the difference between Las Lomas league vs CVC league?

Any agreements for LL to be in the open?

Exactly and they went 10-0 clearly better than 9-1 so head to head doesn’t even come into equation here. They are also D2 or 3 so a loss would bump them back down to their respective division.

 

[Truthhertz]

LL has a pretty good team this year, but wouldn’t be undefeated if they played CVC, Campo & Miramonte. Might have 3 losses.

And CV wouldn’t be 9-1 if they played in a D1 league or didn’t book Stellar Prep, Concord, some nobody team from NV, etc...........so what’s your point here? Can’t have it both ways either strength matters or it doesn’t. LL was 10-0 that beats 9-1 every time.

 

[observer22]

And CV wouldn’t be 9-1 if they played in a D1 league or didn’t book Stellar Prep, Concord, some nobody team from NV, etc...........so what’s your point here? Can’t have it both ways either strength matters or it doesn’t. LL was 10-0 that beats 9-1 every time.

My point? I was responding to the question about Las Lomas and that they had a cream puff schedule but are a decent team. That has nothing to do with CVC’s beating Pitt head to head or being seeded 3rd in the Open. SOS matters a lot, but head to head trumps it much of the time.

 

[Truthhertz]

My point? I was responding to the question about Las Lomas and that they had a cream puff schedule but are a decent team. That has nothing to do with CVC’s beating Pitt head to head or being seeded 3rd in the Open. SOS matters a lot, but head to head trumps it much of the time.

Again both played ridiculous schedules for a D1 open teams that’s my point here. You hang your hat on a week 1 head to head. You do understand head to head only matters in tie breakers right. Last I checked 10-0 beats 9-1 every time. Head to head means nothing when comparing these two. ( to be clear I don’t view LL as a open team. My issue is Rewarding teams that clearly book down for sake of playoff seeding.)

 

[observer22]

Again both played ridiculous schedules for a D1 open teams that’s my point here. You hang your hat on a week 1 head to head. You do understand head to head only matters in tie breakers right. Last I checked 10-0 beats 9-1 every time. Head to head means nothing when comparing these two. ( to be clear I don’t view LL as a open team. My issue is Rewarding teams that clearly book down for sake of playoff seeding.)

I understand your point about CVC being in a weak league (LL’s is even weaker), but the Committee got it right in selecting the top 4 teams for the Open. They weren’t necessarily looking only at records or Pitt wouldn’t have even made the field.But once the 4 teams were chosen, it came down to how to seed them:

Undefeated DLS at #1 was a no brainer.

Liberty was also undefeated, and had won the BVAL (Pitt’s league), in addition to beating Pitt head to head, and also beating the only team that beat CVC (Antioch). Another no brainer - Liberty at #2.

So who do you put at #3? 7-3 Pitt, who finished 2nd in their league, or 9-1 league champ CVC who has been the #4 seed the last 2 years and beat Pitt head to head? In virtually every playoff scenario in every sport, a league champ gets rewarded, and overall record and head to head are big factors. An at large team getting the 4 seed wasn’t a shocker.

I’ll be the first to say I think Pitt is a better team than CVC, and would most likely beat them if they played again, but they already played this year (week 1 or not) and CVC has scoreboard on their side. I’ve got to say this one was also a no brainer for the committee and they probably didn’t spend more than 15 minutes on seeding the Open division, when they had their hands full with actual difficult decisions in the other divisions to make.

 

[Truthhertz]

LL does not even belong in the same conversation as CVC. CVC would beat LL by 50+, running clock. LL struggled against a very weak Acalanes team. they played nobody all season. Comical LL is even brought up.

Comical you can’t focus on the bouncing ball here

 

[Truthhertz]

I understand your point about CVC being in a weak league (LL’s is even weaker), but the Committee got it right in selecting the top 4 teams for the Open. They weren’t necessarily looking only at records or Pitt wouldn’t have even made the field.But once the 4 teams were chosen, it came down to how to seed them:

Undefeated DLS at #1 was a no brainer.

Liberty was also undefeated, and had won the BVAL (Pitt’s league), in addition to beating Pitt head to head, and also beating the only team that beat CVC (Antioch). Another no brainer - Liberty at #2.

So who do you put at #3? 7-3 Pitt, who finished 2nd in their league, or 9-1 league champ CVC who has been the #4 seed the last 2 years and beat Pitt head to head? In virtually every playoff scenario in every sport, a league champ gets rewarded, and overall record and head to head are big factors. An at large team getting the 4 seed wasn’t a shocker.

I’ll be the first to say I think Pitt is a better team than CVC, and would most likely beat them if they played again, but they already played this year (week 1 or not) and CVC has scoreboard on their side. I’ve got to say this one was also a no brainer for the committee and they probably didn’t spend more than 15 minutes on seeding the Open division, when they had their hands full with actual difficult decisions in the other divisions to make.

If comity spent more than 5 minutes on decision or not is irrelevant here. The point is why should any team ever challenge themselves with a schedule if it will ultimately be held against them? What’s done is done here and I get that. But to condone it sets president for repeat. Why would Pitt or anybody else for example ever schedule CV and risk losing? They can simple schedule down rely on their own leagues strength of schedule and CV can never sniff anything higher than a 4 seed. I mean my arguement in all reality would help CV/others not hurt them. It also makes for better high school football.

 

[HSfan82]

If they good enough to be in Open then putting into D1 should be fine. Great idea!! Not getting the save a spot if BOD went open ??? They are #2 seed and not an open team

In addition all brackets should be 8 teams, if you want another champion create a consolation bracket with teams any size. Let them battle out for section champion but not Regional game option. Also if not .500 overall, you dont qualify for any playoff. 3-7 should not be rewarded.

 

[Truthhertz]

If I were Pitt I’d schedule a bunch of terrible D2 teams and never answer a phone call from CV. This ensures them a guaranteed 3 every year. If they win their league they get 2. Simple. This is the flaw in the Open division seeding.

BINGO!

 

[noknight]

 

[remc]

Or, and I hope this is not the case, avoid playing CVC in the preseason and make sure you have a stronger SOS. Even so, with 3 losses (I know, 1 was to CVC) this year to CVC’s 1, it is still possible the committee would have placed CVC ahead of Pitt in the Open even if they hadn’t already settled it on the field. Some people on here commented they felt Pitt may not even get an Open bid with 3 losses. But thankfully the committee selected the best 4 teams.

I like seeing the top teams play each other in the preseason so we can see how they stack up. With the split of the EBAL this year into A & B divisions, it enabled us to see a bunch of EBAL-BVAL matchups, which was great. I wish there was some way to have CVC play at least 1 top BVAL team and one EBAL Mtn team each year, in addition to them playing some challenging OOS games, since the DFAL is mostly just D2/D3. Again I’d rather just see them be placed into one of those leagues.

I think Pitt feels/felt that they could beat CV anytime they felt like it.Just didn’t turn out that way in the season opener. I’m sure they fully expected to win that game. I’m willing to bet that if there was a rematch in the playoffs Pitt would win, and I think(and I’m sure they think) they are the better team.I don’t think this seasons loss to CV would stop the Pirates from scheduling them in the future

 

[Golfpilot]

Somebody tell me why the loser of the open bracket moves on. I would think Folsom, Central, and Saint Francis would all be better candidates for the D1 play in.

 

[observer22]

Somebody tell me why the loser of the open bracket moves on. I would think Folsom, Central, and Saint Francis would all be better candidates for the D1 play in.

They don’t automatically get placed into the D1 play in game. In fact, I’m sure 2 of those other teams you named will be there unless DLS is the loser that moves on. Somewhere along the line, the CCS figured out a loophole to have an extra team move on if they have an Open division. The NCS followed that model. Both allow the Open loser to take the extra spot rather than the winner of a lower division.

For the NCS, this solved the “problem” of DLS being the only D1 team with a chance to play regional or state games. Teams like Pitt most years, SRV, MV, Cal, Foothill, Freedom, & Antioch have all had very good teams in prior years that never had a chance to move on. Now Pitt has had that chance the last 2 years, and it looks like the winner of CVC-Liberty will most likely get that chance this year.

 

[1315]

CVC will most probably be out of this conversation in a few years. It’s been the WildWildWest show there since it’s conversion to charter and the CCC Board of Education is going to slam them during upcoming accreditation for the misdeeds of the Linzeys. A married duo who turned CVC into their own (and friends’) cash cow as a charter. In fact, the poster child of how lack of oversight can turn to greed.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ea...y-charter-gets-new-director-and-policies/amp/

The trickle down will affect their “attraction” efforts for sports. And those families can simply look five miles away for leveraging an athlete student.

 

[Truthhertz]

Lol, funny it’s beating a dead horse now but the horse seemed to think the tactic was hunky dory. Why not enlighten us why 9-1 is more deserving than 10-0 what sports league pro, college, HS, does this? I mean you have master head to head now splain for us the numbers or records angle......lol

 

[observer22]

Rumor is CV is going to the top EBAL next season...

EBAL Mountain? I would think the BVAL would be closer and a better fit, but they don’t belong belong in their current league.

 

[Truthhertz]

EBAL Mountain? I would think the BVAL would be closer and a better fit, but they don’t belong belong in their current league.

Honestly better suited going independent. And get a updated list of current D1 teams in NorCal or even the state.

 

[remc]

EBAL Mountain? I would think the BVAL would be closer and a better fit, but they don’t belong belong in their current league.

Agree, though at least they’d be in a D1 league, which is where they belong

 

[kriart]

BINGO!

Not to worry much, guys. If Pitt gets lucky with Sparty, they'll make another history. Liberty and CVC can rejoice in their shortlived fantasies. Theyre not built for long. Pitt JV shutout Liberty 38-0 and I believe Pitt shutout CVC or shut them down (not sure of score). Pitt JV also shutout Antioch 33-0. Pitt's dynasty will live longer!